Won't run in EV mode, ICE kicks in immediately.

[PaulGo]

to PaulGo

 

I too would like the contact information for your attorney dealing with this unresolved Ford Motor issue. Thanks.

My email is rgwalton17022@gmail.com

I will be sending you a PM with the attorney's name, address and email.

[fun4u]

What is the procedure to initiate a re-balancing by the car itself?

 

I've tried racing the engine in park for about 5 min, which appears to deliver a full charge to the HV battery, but it doesn't improve driving. FFH still will not run in EV mode.

[PaulGo]

What is the procedure to initiate a re-balancing by the car itself?

 

I've tried racing the engine in park for about 5 min, which appears to deliver a full charge to the HV battery, but it doesn't improve driving. FFH still will not run in EV mode.

I brought one of my cars to the dealership, but it did not work. On both my hybrids as the temperature warms up a get a bit more hybrid (EV) time when driving and applying the brakes but nowhere near what it was before the seven months of storage.

[Automate]

What is the procedure to initiate a re-balancing by the car itself?

 

I've tried racing the engine in park for about 5 min, which appears to deliver a full charge to the HV battery, but it doesn't improve driving. FFH still will not run in EV mode.

 

You can't re-balance by racing the engine.

 

The battery charge percentage shown on your dash isn't the real battery charge, it is the usable battery charge range. So when your dash displays 0% battery it is really at something like 40% actual battery charge. And when your dash displays 100% it is really like 70% actual battery charge.

 

When you rev your engine, the car's computer will not allow the actual battery charge to go over 70%. When your car is doing a real re-balance, the car's computer will allow the charge to go over the 70% to aid the re-balancing process.

[fun4u]

So how do I get the car to initiate a re-balance? Is there any way I can do that?

[Automate]

So how do I get the car to initiate a re-balance? Is there any way I can do that?

 

The car will do it on its own every ~10K miles or so.

 

Special diagnostic tools are needed to initiate it manually. The Autel MD 808 is one such tool that reportedly can do it.

[Cnaroach]

My Fusion did it automatically once right after I got it back from the airbag recall, and the dealer claims they did it twice, but it still doesn't run in EV.

[mirak]

I've got the same problem as everyone else. Hybrid functionality is almost completely gone. On colder days (below 50) the ICE kicks on the minute I release the brake pedal. On warmer days the car will at least start moving forward a bit on battery, but the ICE kicks on the moment I apply any acceleration. The days of "pulse and glide" are over - even if I accelerate to about 30mph on a flat surface, the ICE has to stay on to maintain that speed. Mileage has dropped by a few MPG.

 

My car has 115k. I'm the original owner, and purchased it in fall of 2009. I got my airbags replaced, but I really doubt that has anything to do with the problem because I still drove the car intermittently even when I was waiting for the airbag replacement. The car never went more than a few days without being driven at least once.

 

The simple truth seems to be that these batteries are expiring with age/use. I'm pretty angry that I didn't discover this until just outside the warranty window. I can live with the reduced mileage, but I'm more concerned about what all the starting and stopping of the ICE will do to the car in the long run, particularly if the battery performance continue to decline.

 

I'm not sure I want to pay the dealership to tell me what I already know because I'm not ponying up $2-3k for a replacement battery. I'll never get that back in gas savings. If anybody has any luck with Ford standing behind their product, please let us know.

[fun4u]

Mirak,

 

Sounds like the exact problem that I and many others on this site are having. But I disagree that the airbag replacement had nothing to do with the problem. It's interesting that you actually drove the car while waiting for a replacement. Possibly it's the process involved in the airbag replacement that is causing the problem, not the fact that most of us actually followed the Ford instructions for the prolonged idle period. That's a new thought!

 

I'm not willing to accept that the battery problem occurring after the recall is just a "coincidence". As Gibbs (NCIS) says, "there's no such thing as a coincidence".

[PaulGo]

I believe the airbag recall did contribute to the problem for me by causing very infrequent use of my two vehicles (every four weeks) since Ford provided rental cars and told me for safety sake not to drive my vehicles. My two cars were working perfectly before putting them in storage. Using them for only twenty minutes every four weeks left the HV batteries in an abnormal fully charged state which over a period of seven months caused the HV batteries to deteriorate.

[Rob]

Mirak,

But I disagree that the airbag replacement had nothing to do with the problem.

 

As you may or may not know, I have the exact problem and have not had the airbags replaced as they are back ordered.

 

Rob

[Steel705]

I haven't had mine replaced either and I've been having this problem since January. And my car doesn't get stored either. It's a year round car that has served me well until this January.

 

I have suspicion that this has something to do with the temperatures. My brother is a Class A mechanic and the one thing he noticed when he put his scanner on the car was that the engine wasn't getting warm enough. Translation: there is a good chance the thermostat needs changing. Recently, it has warmed up around here and the car runs way better and it runs in EV mode more than it has since the new year.

 

I don't believe the airbag replacement has anything to do with these problems. I'm no expert but changing out an airbag doesn't have anything to do with suspected electrical issues.

 

Through my research, I've learned that the hesitation is probably a throttle body that needs to be cleaned or replaced.

 

And the issue with the EV not working properly has something to do with the outside temperatures. My 2011 FFH already runs better and acts the way it should now that spring is here. I'm going to get the thermostat changed soon and I suspect that will get everything back to normal.

[PaulGo]

Your car may have a thermostat problem but on my two cars the thermostat indicator goes into the mid-rage when warmed up. I do find my two cars do a bit better in the hybrid mode when the outside temperature is warmer, but I believe that has to do with the computer reading thew outside temperature along with the HV batteries maintaining a better charge when the temperature is warmer. I hope it is the thermostat replacement on your car that will get things back to normal. Let us know. Again why on two cars put into storage would both have the same problems when taken out? It would seem unlikely that the thermostat would malfunction on both cars.

[Steel705]

I was just suggesting that as an option. Mine has never been in storage but it did have a 12V battery issue in January that didn't take kindly to being boosted. It threw up a nasty error that told me to shut down immediately. That may be the cause of my issues too because that's when things started. The thermostat running cool was just a secondary thing that was noticed while checking for error codes.

 

 

[murphy]

Battery efficiency is very poor when the battery is cold soaked. The only way the engine can be started is by use of the HVB. The car will do everything it can to keep enough charge in the HVB to start the engine. If that means no hybrid use until the temperature gets high enough that the battery is no longer cold soaked, that is what will happen.

[mirak]

As it happens, the weather yesterday reached the mid-70s. First genuinely warm day of spring. EV functionality did improve. It's still not what it used to be, but I was able to accelerate veeeeeerrry slowly up to a few MPH before the ICE kicked on, and I was also able to pulse and glide for some flat distances at around 30MPH. The Hybrid Battery indicator also began discharging again almost like normal, although it never dropped below about 50% of the meter. And the green meter (whatever it's called) gave me about a half a "bar" of EV room - I used to get about a full bar.

 

That's one of the oddest quirks about this: when the battery performance begins to deteriorate, you would expect the meter to show the battery being depleted, but it actually shows the battery remaining mostly charged and just refusing to deplete.

 

It's amazing that one genuinely warmish day produced such a dramatic improvement, although it's still far from what it used to be. Maybe it will continue to improve? I'll keep you posted.

[Rob]

 

That's one of the oddest quirks about this: when the battery performance begins to deteriorate, you would expect the meter to show the battery being depleted, but it actually shows the battery remaining mostly charged and just refusing to deplete.

 

 

I find that odd as well. I would expect the EV to act normally, just discharge sooner. As it is, with the battery showing nearly full charge it limits the amount of regenerative braking.

 

Rob

[ethermion]

Huh. I was looking at a great deal on a 2012 when we were shopping. I decided to pause, and pre-order a 2013. lithium ion instead of nickel metal sold me. So far, we are good, good, good.

[fun4u]

So, my 2010 FFH uses a nickle metal hydride battery, not a lithium ion?

 

Has anyone had the problem with a post 2013 FFH?

[fun4u]

Woe is me -- in addition to the battery problem, the brakes on my FFH went out yesterday after a "hard stop" on the Interstate. (Tucker wanted my lane.)

 

Dealer where I limped for service says it sounds like the ABS control valve, and he's talking $1,200 for the part!

 

No word from the tech yet, so I'll keep my fingers crossed that it's something more simple and less costly.

[Cnaroach]

Fun4U that sucks. Maybe the EV problem is related to an aging ABS valve and your mechanic will Forrest Gump his way into fixing it.

[ethermion]

So, my 2010 FFH uses a nickle metal hydride battery, not a lithium ion?

 

Has anyone had the problem with a post 2013 FFH?

Yes. A 2010 will be NMH, which would have been state of the art at the time. Same as a Prius of similar vintage. They do suffer from memory effects. If you are handy, and not afraid of high voltage (that can toss you into another zip code), you might find a gently used battery pack at the local bone yard, for not too many coins.

 

Not that I am aware of, at least not battery related. 2013+ FFHs have the lithium batteries, which are a meaningful step forward. Ford raised eyebrows by installing them. Took Boeing a bit to figure out how to deploy lithium batteries without them catching fire, which is undesirable in a car, and really undesirable on a jumbo jet at 30,000 feet in the air. So far, we are goodly-goo. Love our car to bits.

 

Funny business, batteries are. The objective is a lot of power in a small space. Sorta like a bomb.

[fun4u]

"Fun4U that sucks. Maybe the EV problem is related to an aging ABS valve and your mechanic will Forrest Gump his way into fixing it. Cnaroach"

 

I doubt seriously that they are related, other than through my wallet!

[59Freeman]

I have noticed that my FFH dropped to 32 MPG at the time i put a cheaper grade of tires on the car. I have 221000 on a 2010 (2009). Other than the lower mileage the car is very soft when take off from a stop. Also the EV rarely is on and batteries normally show nearly a full charge. Time to start using my PT Cruiser.

 

[fun4u]

Update on my brake problem (I know, not a fit to this forum!)

 

Dealer called to advise that it is the "brake pedal assembly" which will cost a total of nearly $1,400 to repair!

 

Says that the FFH doesn't have a traditional brake booster, but somehow does it through the brake pedal assembly. Makes no sense to me, but I gotta get the repair done.

 

This is the last message I will post related to this brake failure.