Hybrider

Actually no, since you just reminded me of other datapoints that I didn't remember until now. When I set my climate control manually to the lowest fan setting, I did notice a lower initial power draw, where the A/C power draw in the morning was 1.5 kW versus 2.5 kW when I had set the temp to 80° in auto mode. So here is a new, revised summary table, including those tidbits of data I just mentioned: Initial Park Condition and Ambient Temp --------------------------------------------- Low Fan, Shade, 85°-93° Shade, 85°-93° Low Fan, Shade, 107°-110° Shade, 107°-110° Sun, 105° ----------------------- -------------- ------------------------- ---------------- ----------- Initial Peak Draw 1.5 kW (manual) 2.5 kW (auto) 2.5 kW (manual) 3.5 kW (auto) 4.5-5 kW (auto) Duration of Peak Draw 1-2 minutes 1-2 minutes 2-4 minutes 2-4 minutes 2-4 minutes Final Draw 0.4-0.6 kW 0.4-0.6 kW 0.6-0.8 kW 0.6-0.8 kW 0.6-0.8 kW

From all of the posts I've seen here in this forum, especially lately that I have been perusing the older posts, I believe the large amount of posts were not only attributable to the frustrations of not achieving the illusive 47 MPG goal, but also due to the massive amount of recalls and TSBs that were present on the Job1 2013 FFH cars. I am so very grateful to all of you 2013 FFH owners, and to Ford, for having blazed the trails via those early 2013 FFH builds so that I could have a much more enjoyable experience as a 2014 FFH owner, where my main concern is only the achievement of that illusive 47 MPG goal. I salute you all, 2013 FFH owners. :salute: But still with the new MPG ratings, compared to the other hybrid sedan choices in roughly this same price range, the FFH is still very competitive just on the stat alone. And once you factor in the attactiveness of the 2013-2015 FFH design, there really is no competition. :headspin:

Yeah, in my test drive, I wanted to test both the EV and the ICE performance, so immediately after leaving the car lot, I punched the accelerator on that demo FFH and I happened to be doing it on a 10-foot road hill on a curve. So with the combined EV and ICE 188-hp in full throttle, I felt a little like I was in one of the original pony Trans Am racing rivalries between a Mustang against a Camaro, since it was flying over the curving hill quite a bit faster than I had expected from a hybrid...enough to get my adrenalin unexpectedly pumping. So then I drove out to the highway, and confirmed that I could indeed do 65 MPH in EV mode. Between those experiences, along with the exquisite stylish beauty and all of the techy gadgets in the dashboard, I knew the 2014 FFH was the car for me. :love_shower:

I totally agree about the part about reading the owner's manual, AND about the car break-in period being a fallacy, at least for the FFHs. But the rest of the observations above by lolder are based on if you live in the Northern part of the country. :) So if you live in the Southern, hot parts of the country, the temps will also be dropping in the fall, but the MPGs will be going up in the fall, not down. So if you are like me and purchased a FFH in the Southwest in the spring, then your MPGs will be high at that point in Spring. But then when you reach the desert off-the-chart temps in the summer, the MPGs will most likely start dropping. And if you are in the South, your MPGs will rise once again after Fall gets here. :yahoo:

I posted this data as a response to a question I received in the "Fuel Mileage" topic category, but I wanted it to be listed in the "Climate Control" topic category as well, since this is a more appropriate place for this data. Over the course of several days, I have monitored the A/C power draw on the MyView gauge, and the behavior was not at all what I had expected to see. So to begin with, the A/C power draw data for in the morning when I leave for work, when the temps are in the 85°-93° range in my garage (outside temp is actually around 75°-80°), the A/C power draw climbs immediately to about 2.5 kW, no matter whether I am in complete "Auto" mode or in semi-manual mode or in Max A/C mode. It stays at that initial maximum draw for only about 1-2 minutes, and then over the course of about another 1 minute, it drops to a final level fluctuating between 0.4-0.6 kW, and stays at the same low level for rest of the duration of my 30 minute commute. Even if I change the temp or fan speed or air flow path, there is no effect on the A/C power draw, no matter whether I am at the initial high draw or at the final low draw. This was the surprising part for me. Now if I change to Max A/C mode after reaching the final low draw (0.4-0.6 kW), there will be no immediate effect on the A/C power draw. But after about 1 minute, the power draw will very gradually start climbing, and after several minutes of this Max A/C mode, when I can no longer stand it anymore due to the excessive noise, air flow, and coolness, it has only increased the power draw by about 1 kW to about 1.5 kW. I don't know if power draw while in Max A/C mode would keep climbing since I am not able to endure the Max A/C mode any longer after I have reached my limits of endurance. So now for the A/C power draw data for my return trip from work, when the ambient temps are at true desert-level temps. For my drive home from work, when the outside temp is around the 107°-110°, and with my FFH having been parked in the shade, the power draw curve over time is basically the same as I mentioned before, with the max power draw peak being immediately as soon as I turn the A/C on, and the final low power draw being reached a few minutes later. But the difference during these afternoon high temps of the day is that the max initial power draw is about 3.5 kW for about 2-4 minutes, and then the final low draw is slightly higher, fluctuating between 0.6-0.8 kW. The A/C power draw behavior I saw when I have been parked in the sun at 105° is that the peak draw was around 4.5-5 kW for about 2-4 minutes, and the final low draw was the same 0.6-0.8 kW draw that I saw when I started with my FFH in the sshade. To reiterate, I basically saw no difference in the power draws that I saw over the course of several days that could be directly attributable to the varying A/C modes that I had selected. The only variable that seemed to affect the A/C power draws, whether it be the initial peak draw or the final leveled-off draw was the temp inside the car, which was directly correlated to the outside temp and whether my FFH was parked in the sun or in the shade. I monitored the A/C power draw while using various climate control settings, including "Auto" mode with various temp settings between 72° and 80°, and including various semi-auto settings, by changing the fan speed, the air distribution settings, along with changing the set temps, and even using Max A/C, and I did not see any immediate change in the A/C power draw when I changed any of those settings. As I mentioned, the only time I did see any change in power draw was when I left the climate control on Max A/C mode for several minutes after reaching the final low levels, and it would only increase by about 1 kW above the final low draw. Anotber new-to-me observation I have noticed is that there does not seem to be any truly manual mode with my 2014 FFH climate control system since the temp setting is always involved to some degree or another in a semi-auto fashion. Even when the fan is set to a manual, user-specified speed and the air distribution setting is set to a manual, user-specified air vent selection. I have not found any way to not have the temp setting involved in some way, since it always seems to change the output air temp to its own volition. So here is a table summarizing the A/C power draw data, for desert ambient temps, that I have detailed above. Initial Park Condition and Ambient Temp --------------------------------------------- Shade, 85°-93° Shade, 107°-110° Sun, 105° -------------- ---------------- ----------- Initial Peak Draw 2.5 kW 3.5 kW 4.5-5 kW Duration of Peak Draw 1-2 minutes 2-4 minutes 2-4 minutes Final Draw 0.4-0.6 kW 0.6-0.8 kW 0.6-0.8 kW So based on my findings and comments from others in this forum, my BKM (Best-Known Method) that I use now is that I start my summer desert trips in Auto mode, with an initial temp setting of 80°, and then when I start feeling too warm due to the decreasing air temps being output through the mid-level dash vents, I will then drop the temp setting by about 1-2° at a time, which usually eventually ends up stablilizing on a setting in the 74°-76° range. Then, at my final selected auto temp settiing, if my eyes start getting too dried out from the air coming out of the mid-level dash vents, located on either side of the steering wheel which I always leave positioned directly at my face, then I switch the air distribution to be dash vents (middle level) and defrost vents (upper level), thereby being a semi-auto setting. And then I rinse and repeat at the beginning of the next day.

Over the course of several days, I have monitored the A/C power draw on the MyView gauge, and the behavior was not at all what I had expected to see. So to begin with, the A/C power draw data for in the morning when I leave for work, when the temps are in the 85°-93° range in my garage (outside temp is actually around 75°-80°), the A/C power draw climbs immediately to about 2.5 kW, no matter whether I am in complete "Auto" mode or in semi-manual mode or in Max A/C mode. It stays at that initial maximum draw for only about 1-2 minutes, and then over the course of about another 1 minute, it drops to a final level fluctuating between 0.4-0.6 kW, and stays at the same low level for rest of the duration of my 30 minute commute. Even if I change the temp or fan speed or air flow path, there is no effect on the A/C power draw, no matter whether I am at the initial high draw or at the final low draw. This was the surprising part for me. Now if I change to Max A/C mode after reaching the final low draw (0.4-0.6 kW), there will be no immediate effect on the A/C power draw. But after about 1 minute, the power draw will very gradually start climbing, and after several minutes of this Max A/C mode, when I can no longer stand it anymore due to the excessive noise, air flow, and coolness, it has only increased the power draw by about 1 kW to about 1.5 kW. I don't know if power draw while in Max A/C mode would keep climbing since I am not able to endure the Max A/C mode any longer after I have reached my limits of endurance. So now for the A/C power draw data for my return trip from work, when the ambient temps are at true desert-level temps. For my drive home from work, when the outside temp is around the 107°-110°, and with my FFH having been parked in the shade, the power draw curve over time is basically the same as I mentioned before, with the max power draw peak being immediately as soon as I turn the A/C on, and the final low power draw being reached a few minutes later. But the difference during these afternoon high temps of the day is that the max initial power draw is about 3.5 kW for about 2-4 minutes, and then the final low draw is slightly higher, fluctuating between 0.6-0.8 kW. The A/C power draw behavior I saw when I have been parked in the sun at 105° is that the peak draw was around 4.5-5 kW for about 2-4 minutes, and the final low draw was the same 0.6-0.8 kW draw that I saw when I started with my FFH in the sshade. To reiterate, I basically saw no difference in the power draws that I saw over the course of several days that could be directly attributable to the varying A/C modes that I had selected. The only variable that seemed to affect the A/C power draws, whether it be the initial peak draw or the final leveled-off draw was the temp inside the car, which was directly correlated to the outside temp and whether my FFH was parked in the sun or in the shade. I monitored the A/C power draw while using various climate control settings, including "Auto" mode with various temp settings between 72° and 80°, and including various semi-auto settings, by changing the fan speed, the air distribution settings, along with changing the set temps, and even using Max A/C, and I did not see any immediate change in the A/C power draw when I changed any of those settings. As I mentioned, the only time I did see any change in power draw was when I left the climate control on Max A/C mode for several minutes after reaching the final low levels, and it would only increase by about 1 kW above the final low draw. Anotber new-to-me observation I have noticed is that there does not seem to be any truly manual mode with my 2014 FFH climate control system since the temp setting is always involved to some degree or another in a semi-auto fashion. Even when the fan is set to a manual, user-specified speed and the air distribution setting is set to a manual, user-specified air vent selection. I have not found any way to not have the temp setting involved in some way, since it always seems to change the output air temp to its own volition. So here is a table summarizing the A/C power draw data, for desert ambient temps, that I have detailed above. Initial Park Condition and Ambient Temp --------------------------------------------- Shade, 85°-93° Shade, 107°-110° Sun, 105° -------------- ---------------- ----------- Initial Peak Draw 2.5 kW 3.5 kW 4.5-5 kW Duration of Peak Draw 1-2 minutes 2-4 minutes 2-4 minutes Final Draw 0.4-0.6 kW 0.6-0.8 kW 0.6-0.8 kW So based on my findings and comments from others in this forum, my BKM (Best-Known Method) that I use now is that I start my summer desert trips in Auto mode, with an initial temp setting of 80°, and then when I start feeling too warm due to the decreasing air temps being output through the mid-level dash vents, I will then drop the temp setting by about 1-2° at a time, which usually eventually ends up stablilizing on a setting in the 74°-76° range. Then, at my final selected auto temp settiing, if my eyes start getting too dried out from the air coming out of the mid-level dash vents, located on either side of the steering wheel which I always leave positioned directly at my face, then I switch the air distribution to be dash vents (middle level) and defrost vents (upper level), thereby being a semi-auto setting. And then I rinse and repeat at the beginning of the next day.

Would you care to post your saved chat transcript? :)

On a car that has been possibly sitting that long, the components I would be most worried about would be the 12V battery, the tires, and the wipers. So I would probably bring that up as a bargaining tactic. And the fact that they haven't been able to sell it for that long should make them more "motivated" sellers too. ;)

Even though I am relatively new to FFHs and this forum, I can't believe how many different feelings and emotions this announcement from Ford has generated inside of me. But I really, really appreciate all of you on this forum hashing out some of these feelings here, as it helps me to explore and analyze at least some of all of those feelings I am feeling. I'm sure all of us here had the feeling in the back of our minds that this could happen for the FFHs, but it sure seemed to me like the FFH was going to be immune to it and remain at a constant 47 MPG rating across the board since the FFH fuel economy ratings weren't downgraded when the C-MAX was, or even for a quite a long time afterwards. I have had at least one tank (first one actually) that was well above the 47 MPG EPA estimate, even though I never expected to get to the EPA estimates, since I rarely have on any of my previous cars. But even though the hot desert weather has eroded my FE down to the 42-45 range lately, I will ALWAYS FOREVER be striving to reach the 47 MPG rating and beyond, because that is what we do as hybrid and FFH enthusiasts!!!

I downloaded the 2014 gas Fusion Owner's Manual (link below), and printed out the instructions from it for how to change the spare tire, and placed them in the owner's manual in my glove box, in case my aging brain should ever forget any of the details. :confused: http://www.fordservicecontent.com/Ford_Content/Catalog/owner_information/2014-Fusion-Owners-Manual-version-3_om_EN-US_02_2014.pdf

Now that we have reached summer temperatures (85°-110° for the daily range) here in the desert in Arizona, I have seen my HVB performance (and MPGs) go way down hill from what it was before. But now that the ambient temps are mostly above 90° from the get-go early in the morning and right around 105°-110° for my commute home, I can see my HVB takes much longer to charge and loses its charge much faster now at the same consistent highway speeds of 65 MPH that I always drive on the highway (speed limit of 65) during my commute. I have seen comments in this forum about the MPG decrease at increased temps for the FFHs being due to the A/C running, but I have previously easily achieved 47-49 MPG (mostly freeway) when running the A/C at the lowest fan level when the daily temps were in the 65°-90° range. I am still able to run the A/C at the lowest fan level most of the time even when the temps are between 100° and even 110°, so that doesn't seem to be cause of my decreased MPG. Whereas I was getting 47-49 MPG previously with the A/C running, I am getting more like 43-45 MPG, a dramatic drop to me, seemingly due to just the increased temps here in AZ. I don't even want to see what happens to my FE when we start getting up to the 115°-119° highs that we get frequently here in the hottest part of the summer. The Tesla website has a really cool range calculator where you can input your typical driving conditions. And if you input the summer temps we typically see in AZ in the summer, you will see their single-charge range drops dramatically with desert summer temps, probably more of a drop in range than if I were to drive their car at 75 or 80 MPH instead of my now-typical 65 MPH. Also another thing I have noticed here in Arizona, due to having warmer temps than everywhere else in the country, is that the EV+ mode is basically useless for me, since my car just about always starts up in EV (silent) mode. In fact, it wasn't until recently when we reached summer temps here that my FFH would ever start up with the ICE immediately, and that seems to be mostly due to my HVB discharging so rapidly on the road and even discharging some while the car is off, seemingly due to the temperatures hovering around 100°-110° for most of the day. I was wondering if anyone in the Southwest desert region of the country has ever tried using the ScanGauge to confirm this gut-feel that I have about the HVB performance at temps above 100° having such an impact on the HVB performance at these extremely high summer temps. And summer in AZ sucks for a FFH owner, but so far not nearly as bad as it seemed to suck for those in the cold, cold winter up North this past winter, and I'm hoping it stays that way for the rest of the summer here. I know, I know...I shouldn't worry about this small percentage decrease in MPGs, since I am still getting super MPGs and loving every minute of it. But I just wanted to share my experiences about high temps affecting my HVB performance, and whine a little bit about it since I was getting such great fuel economy before the high temps hit, and with very little effort on my part (as I was already driving my previous 2004 Buick Century like a granny). And it is a bit depressing to see my lifetime MPG average starting to go down for the very first time ever in the 3500 miles (4 months of ownership) I have put on my glorious, fabulous FFH. I love it when others on this forum gleam and gloat about the goodness of the FFHs, and I have no choice but to do so too. Sometimes I really feel like Ford designed my SE configuration of the FFH specifically targeted at me, since it is a top-of-the-line, full hybrid, packed into a luxuriously-comfortable mid-size sedan, and that looks so totally sporty and awesome on top of all of that techy greatness. Whoo-hoo for FFHs and FFH owners!!! :yahoo: :worship:

No, I've never reset it since I want it to be a true lifetime average. I'm curious though, if I reset it, will it go to "0.0" or some other value?

It is listed as "Avg Fuel Economy", "Average Fuel", or "Avg MPG" in the 2014 owner's manual, and it is available on most of the main screens, including the Empower, and also on the MyView which is the view I use most now, where I select the "Tach rpm x 1000 + Avg MPG", so I can see the most precise indicator of when the ICE starts and stops, along with the "Fuel History" view so I can get a good idea of what my current trip MPGs will be once I stop. But this is the exact same average MPG value (44.5 MPG) that is shown on my Trip 2 screen which I am using as my pseudo-Lifetime Summary.

That is my point, that the first 10 miles are miniscule in an average calculation when compared to the total of 2700 miles I currently have on my odometer. And in a true average calculation, there is no way those 10 miles could "warp" the total average calculation to any great extent. For a worst case type of an example, say I had only gotten 20 MPG for those first 10 miles, then the average calc for those 10 miles would have been something like: 10 miles / 0.5 gal = 20 MPG So say in the next 2700 miles, I had these example results: 2700 miles / 57.4 gal = 47 MPG So then the total average calculation for those combined 2710 miles would then be: 2710 miles / 57.9 gal = 46.8 MPG So you see, there should be very little warpage due to those first 10 miles of bad MPGs, after another 2700 miles of good MPGs are added into the mix, at least not to any real sigificance. And as you mentioned, having the little affect on my displayed average MPGs should bring it even closer to reality since the displayed trip and average MPGs are on the optimistic side. Yes, sometimes they are significantly higher. I have seen as much as 3 MPG difference between actual pump_tank_gallons_to_odometer calculations versus the displayed trip summary for that fill-up.

My experience has been pretty much the opposite, where I got much better MPGs during the break-in period, the first 800 miles. But that could be very possibly due to the fact I live in the desert, and it was much cooler temps during those first 800 miles. Mild weather definitely seems to contribute significantly to better MPGs. There were only 10 miles on my special-order FFH when I got it, and the MPGs for those first 800 miles, after I had used up half of the initial dealer-filled tank, were around 49-50 MPG. Since then, for the next 2000 miles, it has been averaging between 42 and 45 MPG per half-tank fill-up. So my MPGs during my break-in period were quite a bit better than they are now. One other thing I noticed during these first 3 months of ownership is that the lifetime average MPG calculations don't seem to be straight forward "average" calculations. I say this because when I got my FFH with 10 miles on it, the lifetime average was either in the high 20s or low 30s. But after I had put about 800 miles on it, after those initial 10 miles were put on by the factory and the dealer, with the vast majority of my trips being between 42 MPG and 55 MPG, then the lifetime average should have immediately jumped up into the 40s at least, since 800 miles of excellent MPGs would have totally outweighed those initial 10 miles no matter what the MPGs were during that time. But it has crept up ever so slowly, and currently after putting about 2700 miles on my car, I have gradually reached 44.5 lifetime average. If it were a true average calculation, it would have been up in the 40s or even 50s after only about 200 miles, since those 200 miles of excellent MPGs would have completely outweighed any hot-rodding the factory or dealer could have done in those first measly 10 miles they put on it before I got it. So I have no clue how the lifetime average is calculated, but there is some kind of weird weighting that kept it from rising immediately into the 40s. I must have put about 1000 miles on my new FFH before I broke the 40 MPG lifetime average barrier. But with that being said, my FFH does have several strikes against it's MPGs from the get-go that prevent me from achieving the maximum potential FFH MPGs of 47 or even higher. A few of those strikes against my MPGs are that I have the 18" tires, I have also added a donut spare with the full jack/wrench complement in the trunk and kept the stock air compressor in it as well and added heavy emergency triangles, and I also rarely ever let the gas tank get below a half tank full of gas. So I figured that anything over 44 MPG lifetime average for me would be gravy, AND my lifetime MPGs are still creeping up, but oh so asymptotically slow. I calculate at this rate I should be at 45.0 lifetime MPG in about 2-4 weeks. :) Ford Fusion Hybrids are the greatest. I catch myself staring at my car quite frequently as I walk away because I like its looks so much. And then to get these awesome MPGs on top of it, it's the "bomb". :yahoo:

I'm no expert, but to my eyes the Ruby Red looks like a Candy-Apple Red.

I personally believe the better-gripping 18" tires can help me in some ways to get higher MPGs, since I can maintain more of my speed through the corners, and then I don't have to re-accelerate as much after the corner which seems to be the major contributor to lower MPGs for me.

The new, real 2015 Fusion Order Guide is now available at this BOF link. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13875

The real 2015 Fusion Order Guide (for gas and Hybrid, but not Energi) is now available at a BOF link. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13875

The Ford Fusion order guide seems to be the most authoritative and accurate info on options I have seen, but it did pretty much jive with the Ford Fusion "Build & Price" info I found. You might need to click on the deep links throughout the "Build & Price" pages for the specific options to see the complete details for what is included in each package and option choice. Here are some different links to the 2014 Order Guide, one is the latest version. I have still not seen the 2015 Order Guide on the web. Latest 2014 version: http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13358 /* Requires blueovalforums.com account. */ Older 2014 versions: http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13085 http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2014-ford-fusion-order-guide/

All you have to do to confirm if your ESP is active is to go to this Ford ESP link below (easy to google too with "ford esp"; first link), and proceed to search for the price of the ESP plan you would like (or already have), and it will ask for your VIN. Once you plug in the VIN, it will say you already have a plan if your VIN is in the ESP computer system. BTW, I did get mine for a really good price through FloodFordESP.com. http://owner.ford.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Owner/Page/ESPPage If you already have an ESP, it will say something like this: Our records indicate you have existing ESP coverage on your vehicle. Please contact your dealer with any questions you may have concerning your service contract. The Ford ESP site above gave me this message above within a day or two of purchasing my ESP from FloodFordESP.com.

I have also seen this lag while driving in 75°-80° temps. But for me, it seems to occur mostly while I am going up a slight incline, and then when I let off the gas a little to encourage a quicker switch to the EV mode. It seems like the computer is unsure whether the conditions I am driving under will allow it to stay in EV mode once the computer has actually made the switch to EV mode, since the current load at that time is on the brink of requiring the ICE.

As I mentioned previously, my dealer's list price was a hair higher than those that were listed on fordparts.com. Here is the price breakdown that I paid for each part, not including any taxes or mounting charges. Part Price Invoice part# ------ --------- ------------- wheel $161.78 CV6Z-1015-B box assy $53.25 DS7Z-9913546-A jack $121.25 DS7Z-17080-A lugwrench $37.04 CP9Z-17032-A tire $158.35 125/90R16 (includes shipping)

For everything I listed in the parts table above, including the tire, and with mounting labor cost, TT&L, shop fees, etc., it cost me a little below $600 total. The prices that my dealer charged me were just a bit more than what the fordparts.com site listed for all of the parts...surprisingly one part was exactly the same price as fordparts.com, the 16" steel wheel. I figure for someone that lives where there is no sales tax, and if their dealer can get the new tire for $70-$100 somewhere, then their total could be around $500. And for some, it would most likely cost more than the $600 I paid, so that is how I came up with the $500-$600+ range I mentioned in my post.