New 2014 Honda Accord Hybrid

[hybridbear]

New test drive article for the Accord Hybrid.

 

Check out this article from USA TODAY:

 

Accord hybrid's pluses wipe out minuses

 

http://usat.ly/PwgzCK

 

Take away for me.

 

- MFT very easy to use

- YMWV

- I love the quietness of my FFH in any situation

I saw this article too. This article is a great example of how uneducated supposed "experts" are. This automotive journalist didn't even seem to try to understand Honda's eCVT design, instead he just whined about belt & pulley CVTs. I don't have much respect for USA Today. They're about as bad as Fox News in my experience.

[dalesky]

Test drove the basic model recently. Not a crisp handler, but very competent feeling. Lots of high quality materials, good cabin room, and small trunk. No pass thru at all for the back seat. The transmission/engine aren´t as smooth as I expected. Didnt really like it. At speed it felt fine, but when accelerating not so smooth. Really disliked the busyness of the center stack. So many things there that it seemed unfinished. Poorly thoight out maybe.

Overall an impressive package but the car the FFH is.

The salesman said they were in very short supply for some reason. I've seen no advertising for the hybrid either.

[dalesky]

And once you get used to the smooth sound and acceleration of the hybrid you'll never want to go back to a non-hybrid car.

Also, when you put your foot in it there is plenty of spirited response.

[Ted Swing]

Interestingly, so far the HAH is averaging 39.1 MPG in Fuelly (compared to 37.8 for the 2014 FFH) and 40.8 on fueleconomy.gov (compared to 41.1 for the FFH). In other words, either 1.3 MPG higher or 0.3 MPG lower than the FFH.

 

That's good fuel economy and no doubt it will improve as the weather gets warmer, but not the big advantage over the FFH that early reviews were suggesting.

[dalesky]

Interestingly, so far the HAH is averaging 39.1 MPG in Fuelly (compared to 37.8 for the 2014 FFH) and 40.8 on fueleconomy.gov (compared to 41.1 for the FFH). In other words, either 1.3 MPG higher or 0.3 MPG lower than the FFH.

 

That's good fuel economy and no doubt it will improve as the weather gets warmer, but not the big advantage over the FFH that early reviews were suggesting.

Doesn't surprise me, given the size of the car, and the combination of the gas and electric motors. I think a HAH buyer will be happy with that. Also, what you don't know, i.e. other cars mileage, won't bother a lot of drivers either. We on this forum are a subset of very informed owners, whereas I suspect that most hybrid buyers are just driving their cars.

[wmayo]

Okay. Just my impressions. I have two cars:

I have a 2010 FFH (yes, a little older) ... and LOVE IT. In May 2009, which I bought it, it was head and shoulders above everybody else.

I LOVE the interface to media/audio/etc. as well as the maps. The fog lamps are a plus, as well as the trunk feed through (though I've never really used it). The sound system (SONY) is top notch. The bluetooth with my RAZR MAXX HD is great ... read texts to me while I drive. It drives snappy AND smooth. And, I usually get 39 to 44 mpg, with highs pushing 47 mpg sometimes around town. I've NEVER regretted the purchase.

 

I also have a 2014 HAH. The interface to entertainment isn't great (as good), but useable. The Pandora works just fine with cellphone. Once I found how to turn up the subwoofer, sound is pretty good, but it still doesn't seem to be as balanced or fully smooth across frequencies (Still playing with that). The cumulative trip mileage is NOT instant like the Fusion. I updates every 10 sec.s or so. Realtime is okay. Cellphone texting (incoming) does NOT "speak" in the car like Fusion does (supposedly newer SAMSUNG phones will). Car does float, and is the quietest vehicle I've ever driven ... except with the engine winds up a little a times (to charge or drive car). I declare, it seems the Accord is in EV mode 1/3 of the time or more, even at 55-60 mph. It just charges up the battery, then poof, EV lights comes on, and lasts for a while. It has a totally different approach to hybrid running than any other vehicle. So, here's one big thing. OMG ... the mileage has been incredible. In my first two weeks now, I've been getting generally 53-63 mpg in mixed highway and city. I even got 69 mpg in a recent trip to my office from home, and 64 to the hospital. The "forced" EV button does help hypermile, but only forced in at lower speeds (not highway). I'm just saying, the mileage is quite remarkable.

 

My wife just simply pushed for the Honda. If ... a big if ... trunk space was not a factor, I really wanted the plugin Fusion. But, as it turns out. I'm really enjoying the HAH. I still love my Fusion. It's just seems better designed in the electronics, and some other options. The HAH, just does woo me quite a bit because of the big mileage. Maybe more observations coming as I get to know it better.

 

[hybridbear]

Okay. Just my impressions. I have two cars:

I have a 2010 FFH (yes, a little older) ... and LOVE IT. In May 2009, which I bought it, it was head and shoulders above everybody else.

I LOVE the interface to media/audio/etc. as well as the maps. The fog lamps are a plus, as well as the trunk feed through (though I've never really used it). The sound system (SONY) is top notch. The bluetooth with my RAZR MAXX HD is great ... read texts to me while I drive. It drives snappy AND smooth. And, I usually get 39 to 44 mpg, with highs pushing 47 mpg sometimes around town. I've NEVER regretted the purchase.

 

I also have a 2014 HAH. The interface to entertainment isn't great (as good), but useable. The Pandora works just fine with cellphone. Once I found how to turn up the subwoofer, sound is pretty good, but it still doesn't seem to be as balanced or fully smooth across frequencies (Still playing with that). The cumulative trip mileage is NOT instant like the Fusion. I updates every 10 sec.s or so. Realtime is okay. Cellphone texting (incoming) does NOT "speak" in the car like Fusion does (supposedly newer SAMSUNG phones will). Car does float, and is the quietest vehicle I've ever driven ... except with the engine winds up a little a times (to charge or drive car). I declare, it seems the Accord is in EV mode 1/3 of the time or more, even at 55-60 mph. It just charges up the battery, then poof, EV lights comes on, and lasts for a while. It has a totally different approach to hybrid running than any other vehicle. So, here's one big thing. OMG ... the mileage has been incredible. In my first two weeks now, I've been getting generally 53-63 mpg in mixed highway and city. I even got 69 mpg in a recent trip to my office from home, and 64 to the hospital. The "forced" EV button does help hypermile, but only forced in at lower speeds (not highway). I'm just saying, the mileage is quite remarkable.

 

My wife just simply pushed for the Honda. If ... a big if ... trunk space was not a factor, I really wanted the plugin Fusion. But, as it turns out. I'm really enjoying the HAH. I still love my Fusion. It's just seems better designed in the electronics, and some other options. The HAH, just does woo me quite a bit because of the big mileage. Maybe more observations coming as I get to know it better.

 

Cool! Thanks for sharing! I hope you'll come back and share more comparisons in the future.

[inco]

You are fortunate to have two hybrids in the family and be able to easily compare one to the other and the progress that has been made in the intervening years. Keep us posted on your "affair" and let us see how Honda has improved the breed with their version. Of course the best test will be when it comes time to replace the 2010 and decide what you want then.. :shift:

[B25Nut]

Consumer Reports recommends the standard Accord over the HAH:

http://www.9news.com/story/money/personal-finance/consumer/2014/05/28/honda-accord-vs-hybrid/9663935/

They feel "It doesn't have all the compromises the Accord Hybrid does." CR also only got 40 mpg when they tested the HAH.

[corncobs]

Consumer Reports recommends the standard Accord over the HAH:

http://www.9news.com/story/money/personal-finance/consumer/2014/05/28/honda-accord-vs-hybrid/9663935/

They feel "It doesn't have all the compromises the Accord Hybrid does." CR also only got 40 mpg when they tested the HAH.

and not even a mentioning of the any other competitors. CR seems to like the TCH a lot even being to lowest in FE ( I just wonder why )

[hybridbear]

Consumer Reports recommends the standard Accord over the HAH:

http://www.9news.com/story/money/personal-finance/consumer/2014/05/28/honda-accord-vs-hybrid/9663935/

They feel "It doesn't have all the compromises the Accord Hybrid does." CR also only got 40 mpg when they tested the HAH.

The big gripe I have with CR is how they publish their MPG numbers like they're correct and everyone else is wrong. MotorTrend recently started doing their own version of MPG testing and they got 49 MPG city & 42 MPG highway in the C-Max (http://www.intellichoice.com/1-12-2013-52053-56/2013-ford-sel-4dr-wagon-real-mpg.html). In the Fusion Energi they got 41 MPG city & 55 MPG highway (http://www.intellichoice.com/1-12-2014-53708-56/2014-ford-titanium-4dr-sedan-real-mpg.html). They seem to beat EPA estimates on hybrids. However, if you look at gas cars like the 4 cyl Accord that CR raves about, MotorTrend got far lower than EPA estimates in the city and only slightly better on the highway. The same is true for other popular midsize sedans like the Sonata.

[acdii]

Maybe CR needs to hire some better drivers. Apparently they only know how to drive a regular car, and drive Hybrids like regular cars. While the Fusion can be driven like a regular car and still get decent MPG, slight changes in how you drive the car make all the difference in the world. Not rocket science, just takes practice and some reading of these forums.

 

 

I don't care what CR say's anyways, the cars they rave about don't do anything for me, they lack a lot of nice features, and are pretty much plain ordinary run of the mill look like all the rest cars. I saw a HAH the other day, it looked weird from behind. Looked like someone squished it from the lower sides like a marshmallow.

[B25Nut]

This is today's Green Car Reports road test of the HAH. They love it.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1092359_2014-honda-accord-hybrid-video-road-test

[hybridbear]

This is today's Green Car Reports road test of the HAH. They love it.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1092359_2014-honda-accord-hybrid-video-road-test

I found it really interesting that they comment about how the EPA numbers for the Honda are realistic, but then they don't talk about what kind of fuel economy they observed.

[GrySql]

I don't care what CR say's anyways, the cars they rave about don't do anything for me, they lack a lot of nice features, and are pretty much plain ordinary run of the mill look like all the rest cars. I saw a HAH the other day, it looked weird from behind. Looked like someone squished it from the lower sides like a marshmallow.

My feelings exactly.

[hybridbear]

The big gripe I have with CR is how they publish their MPG numbers like they're correct and everyone else is wrong. MotorTrend recently started doing their own version of MPG testing and they got 49 MPG city & 42 MPG highway in the C-Max (http://www.intellichoice.com/1-12-2013-52053-56/2013-ford-sel-4dr-wagon-real-mpg.html). In the Fusion Energi they got 41 MPG city & 55 MPG highway (http://www.intellichoice.com/1-12-2014-53708-56/2014-ford-titanium-4dr-sedan-real-mpg.html). They seem to beat EPA estimates on hybrids. However, if you look at gas cars like the 4 cyl Accord that CR raves about, MotorTrend got far lower than EPA estimates in the city and only slightly better on the highway. The same is true for other popular midsize sedans like the Sonata.

Here's an example of CR acting like they're God and everyone else must listen to them:

'CR': Honda Accord hybrid mpg rating way off

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/05/29/consumer-reports-honda-accord-hybrid-mpg-rating/9724733/

Edited May 30, 2014 by hybridbear

[lolder]

Almost all hybrids ( and many other ) cars have large variations in mileage with temperature and speed. I think the EPA tests are done at 60-70 º F. If the media testers perform their tests in 40 º F colder temperatures, that's worth about -8 mpg right there The EPA highway test averages around 50 mph and cruising at 70 mph would cause a 10 mpg loss. Cars that are more aerodynamic like the Prius ( often teased for it's shape ) suffer less from higher speeds and achieve EPA numbers more often. When temperatures are 90-95 º F., EPA numbers are often exceeded. Above that, AC load takes too much a toll. There's not much yearly cost difference between 40 and 50 mpg so other factors should weigh heavily in choosing a vehicle. If you're going to drive 30K miles a year at 80 mph, TDIs are probably the best if you think VWs will be dependable. Prii are not bad at high speed either if you think they're comfortable enough.

[dalesky]

Maybe CR needs to hire some better drivers. Apparently they only know how to drive a regular car, and drive Hybrids like regular cars. While the Fusion can be driven like a regular car and still get decent MPG, slight changes in how you drive the car make all the difference in the world. Not rocket science, just takes practice and some reading of these forums.

 

 

I don't care what CR say's anyways, the cars they rave about don't do anything for me, they lack a lot of nice features, and are pretty much plain ordinary run of the mill look like all the rest cars. I saw a HAH the other day, it looked weird from behind. Looked like someone squished it from the lower sides like a marshmallow.

I'm sorry, is there any question that we are driving the best looking car? No, I didn't think so!

[B25Nut]

Last night when I got off the freeway, what I would have sworn was a Fusion with a blacked-out grill and Dune interior pulled in behind me. It ended up being a silver Aston-Martin.

[Texasota]

Maybe CR needs to hire some better drivers. Apparently they only know how to drive a regular car, and drive Hybrids like regular cars. While the Fusion can be driven like a regular car and still get decent MPG, slight changes in how you drive the car make all the difference in the world. Not rocket science, just takes practice and some reading of these forums.

 

Okay, I've put on by flack jacket and I will likely need it after this post. Somebody has to defend CR so it might as well be me since I already have that reputation.

 

I just went back and looked at the CR article in the February 2014 CR issue where they retested their 2013 FFH with the software updates (the updates designed to improve MPG). CR stated that in their original test of their 2013 FFH: "The Fusion sedan got a stellar 39 MPG overall". CR retested again immediately before and after the software update and they saw less than a 1 MPG improvement. So they probably saw something close to 39.5 MPG on their test after the software update.

 

I just looked at fuelly.com numbers and it shows this:

 

2014 FFH: 39.1 MPG (457,009 miles tracked)

2013 FFH: 40.4 MPG (596,628 miles tracked)

 

According to those fuelly numbers (based on 1,053,637 actual owner miles) CR results were within 2.2% of the 2013 fuelly numbers and CR's results were slightly better than the 2014 fuelly numbers. I'd say CR's results are pretty darn close to real world numbers that owners are reporting on fuelly.com.

 

This is an old debate but is worth repeating. Most FFH owners drive it like a normal car. The majority of FFH owners are not hybrid enthusiasts like the highly knowledgeable and motivated folks here on this forum. The fuelly.com numbers strongly suggest that is the case. Could CR drive the hybrid cars differently than traditional cars and report significantly better MPGs? You bet they could. But they could also apply those same driving techniques to traditional cars and also get significantly better MPGs. But that would not accurately reflect real world driving and CR would be strongly citicized for reporting inaccurate MPG results that the majority of owners will not achieve.

 

CR is testing and reporting MPG results that are about as "real world" as you can get and the fuelly numbers confirm that. Only my opinion, but that is how I think CR should do it and I would hate to see them start using a different set of MPG testing parameters for hybrids.

[corncobs]

It's a good thing that this forum has a boatload of skilled people that like driving their hybrid to its maximum capabilities. I betcha that those few with very high numbers bring up the average.

 

I think you are right that CR drive they car more mainstream like with brings it down to the average we see on fuelly. On the other hand I also believe that fuelly number would be slightly higher if fuelly would clean up dead accounts once and a while. You can find some really low but old and inactive accounts.

 

I think what irritates most people that like the FFH how CR just "trash talks" "our" car and makes a less appealing lower MPG car sounds like there is nothing else in the world.

[acdii]

I think what they need to do is have two examples, one driving like a normal car, and one driven like a Hybrid. For the average driver, here is what you can expect to get from the car, however if you hypermile, you can expect to see this. Now if they hypermile and still can't get even close to EPA, now that is something they can trash talk.

 

On Fuelly there are quite a few cars that are under performers, that no matter how you drive them, they get poor MPG, and those do bring down the total average. I wouldn't be surprised if the BD is still accounted for. Currently my HyTi is getting 45-46 MPG daily, my last fill was 46.7 MPG. It only took 20K miles to break in. LOL

[Texasota]

I think what they need to do is have two examples, one driving like a normal car, and one driven like a Hybrid. For the average driver, here is what you can expect to get from the car, however if you hypermile, you can expect to see this. Now if they hypermile and still can't get even close to EPA, now that is something they can trash talk.

 

Acdii, you have posted numerous times that the 2013+ FFHs is a different animal and it requires different driving techniques than other hybrids (different even than the 2010 - 2012 FFHs). I am not challenging the validity your posts because you have experience driving several different kinds of hybrids.

 

I suspect HAH owners could probably make the same claim and this illustrates what a slippery slope it would become for any testing group (including CR) to begin reporting MPG results for a regular driver and for a hypermiler driver. No testing agency can develop hybrid testing parameters that would be optimal for each hybrid. You would need a set of experts for the FFH, another set for the HAH, another set for the TCH etc. It would become an impossible mess and each manufacture would have legitimate reasons to cry foul.

 

CR's results are accurate for the majority of real world drivers and the fuelly numbers back that up. The EPA's MPG testing parameters seem to favor hybrids, in general, so it would seem we already have the second "example" that you are suggesting. I have more confidence that CR's numbers are more real world than the EPA’s numbers and many other trade articles have confirmed that in their MPG testing.

[acdii]

I hate to say it, but I actually agree with what you say. The cars do have different techniques. The First Gen Ford and second Gen Toyotas are identical to driving styles, as well as the current gen Toyota Camry prius and Avalon. Since I haven't driven, nor care to, the Honda, I can't comment on its technique, but if you can drive the Fusion, the others will be a cinch. The big difference between the Fusion and the others is the fact it has EV at highway speeds, and this is what sets it apart from the others, and where the technique is different. Knowing when to EV and not is the key.

 

Then again a driver proficient in the Fusion, can make the others look REALLY good in EPA.

[dalesky]

This is a great ongoing topic! What I would like to say, as a fanboy, is that, having driven all of the mentioned hybrids, the Fusion is my choice. It remains my choice for a number of reasons, not the least of which is the fact that once it learns a regularly driven route it is capable of returning amazing mileage. I would think that is true of the others, though I think the FFH 'learning' software is unique.

I do drive mine like a regular car most of the time, but try to engage the battery as much as possible. I don't consider it hypermiling, but I am mindful of my technique with the gas and the brakes.

If any owner, or legitimate car tester, drives their car differently than I do, fine! All I know is that hybrids like ours are amazing technological feats, and for whatever reasons anyone has for buying them, make sense. Of course most of us here are enthusiasts, and most try to maximize mileage, with some taking it to extremes.

Much of this talk about mileage is subjective, and king of personal. How I drive, the mileage I get, and whether or not I am satisfied is based on my expectations, and feeling whether or not I am getting my money's worth.

Keep this topic going- it is always interesting.