parked 3-4 days hv battery discharges ??

[tempforce]

if i use the car every day or every other day.. i turn on the key and the hv battery is around 3/4 charge. i can drive in electric mode for several blocks before the ic engine starts...

if the car sits for a few days, i turn the key on, the hv battery is less than 1/4 charge and the ic engine starts up.

is it normal for the hv battery to discharge while parked???

thank you.

 

[dalesky]

I would not assume that it is actually discharge. I can't think why that would be the case. Any drain should be on the normal car battery, for things like security system, settings such as radio and nav, etc. Anyone have any knowledge on this? I do have a long trip planned and am wondering myself.

[VonoreTn]

I wouldn't read too much into that, my engine always starts as I back out of the garage, but the car has been very consistently providing 40 mpg, day in and day out. Be aware that being in electric mode is not the key to good mileage. The key is the regen mode while braking, and the computer babying the IC engine, with acceleration and hill climbing support from the electric motors, and then storing electricity at every opportunity while the ICE is in an efficient low speed, loaded, mode. Keeping the engine loaded, with the throttle plate open makes the engine a lot like a diesel, no wasted energy just creating a vacuum in the manifold. Of course there is much more to it than that regarding the efficiency of the system, but it is one of the best systems out there. Others on this forum have much more expertise than I do on the subject. The engine sometimes will start just to warm itself up, or for some other not clear to us reason. I wouldn't try to second guess the computer.

 

See my full mpg chart, every gas event has been logged for 76,000 miles. The computer summaries, when you zero it at fillup, are usually very close to actual measured mpg.

 

http://i911.photobucket.com/albums/ac317/vonoretn/FFH/mpgvsmiles4_zps8115e33f.jpg

Edited September 17, 2013 by VonoreTn

[B25Nut]

76K miles! That's impressive. Your experience is a good sign for all of us. Do you attribute the sub-35 mpg fillups before you got to 50K to cold weather? What changes have you seen since the PCM update? Being in electric mode at higher speeds seems to play a major part in my 18%+ increase in MPG since the update.

[hybridbear]

The HVB shouldn't discharge noticeably. According to my ScanGauge the power draw from the HVB drops to 0.03 amps as soon as the car is shut off. This draw is because it is still powering the screens, etc. Once the car is off the HVB is electronically disconnected from the rest of the car.

[lolder]

76K miles! That's impressive. Your experience is a good sign for all of us. Do you attribute the sub-35 mpg fillups before you got to 50K to cold weather? What changes have you seen since the PCM update? Being in electric mode at higher speeds seems to play a major part in my 18%+ increase in MPG since the update.

Vonore's FFH is a 2010 Gen I with a NiMH HVB but they all operate similarly. The HVB shouldn't discharge while off but it's temperature may cause the system to report it's charge capacity differently.

[acdii]

Only way to know if its actually the pack or if its the controls is to have a voltage reading from when the car is shut off, to when first started the next time. Shouldn't be more than a volt or two difference, anything greater means the pack is losing capacity, or a relay is sticking. NiMh batteries tend to hold their charge in temperature swings and are fairly stable, but if a cell weakens, it can draw down the rest of the pack. I have a 12V pack that is like this. If I charge it up and use it right away, its nice and strong, but if I charge it a let it sit a week, it no longer has any power.

 

If you get a Scan Gauge you can set one of the Xgauges to battery voltage and take readings. If you see that the voltages are inline with the dash, then chances are the battery is leaking down, but if the voltage remains the same, then you know its a software glitch.

[VonoreTn]

76K miles! That's impressive. Your experience is a good sign for all of us. Do you attribute the sub-35 mpg fillups before you got to 50K to cold weather? What changes have you seen since the PCM update? Being in electric mode at higher speeds seems to play a major part in my 18%+ increase in MPG since the update.

Definitely cold weather brings down my mpg's, plus some of that was climbing 8000 feet from the Mississippi river to the ski area past Denver, driving into the wind in the 70 mph plus range most of the way. We did that twice so far with our FFH, and will do it again this Christmas week. Around home I can keep it in the 40+ mpg range without much difficulty.

[KingJL]

Vonore, hello from Madisonville! Your '10 seems to be doing what it is supposed to do. My '13 is getting 46- 48 consistantly around here in current coditions. Dec- Mar, was getting 44 - 46.

[KingJL]

Not sure how long it took, but this past April 20 I had to make an emergency RV trip to Cedar City UT... Was gone until June 4. The '13 FFH sat parked the whole time. When I got back, the FFH was completely shut down... Could not operate door locks... Anything. Had to pry off door lock cover to get in. It had to be jumped to get any electrical response let alone start. Been running fine since.

[murphy]

Not sure how long it took, but this past April 20 I had to make an emergency RV trip to Cedar City UT... Was gone until June 4. The '13 FFH sat parked the whole time. When I got back, the FFH was completely shut down... Could not operate door locks... Anything. Had to pry off door lock cover to get in. It had to be jumped to get any electrical response let alone start. Been running fine since.

The owner's manual says that if the car is going to sit for more than 30 days the 12 volt battery should be disconnected.

With the battery disconnected a second battery would have to be connected to the terminals under the hood to be able to open the trunk if it wasn't left open.

[acdii]

The owner's manual says that if the car is going to sit for more than 30 days the 12 volt battery should be disconnected.

With the battery disconnected a second battery would have to be connected to the terminals under the hood to be able to open the trunk if it wasn't left open.

You can get into the trunk through the back seat though, so a second battery isnt really needed.

 

Unlike the older Focus that had no key hole, and the rear seat didn't fold down.

[dalesky]

I will be gone over 3 weeks, so I think I will trickle charge the 12V battery. Not able to do that with the Mustang, since I only have 1 charger. I can always charge that battery when I get back, since I won't need it the day we return. It does have a new Fomoco battery too.

[VonoreTn]

Vonore, hello from Madisonville! Your '10 seems to be doing what it is supposed to do. My '13 is getting 46- 48 consistantly around here in current coditions. Dec- Mar, was getting 44 - 46.

You are the first person I have noticed that is getting the advertised 47 mpg for the new 13. I have a friend in Tellico Village with a Prius, and he says he gets about 44 when he drives and 41 when his wife drives. So you are doing real good. How many miles do you have now, and how much has been high speed highway driving? I can get high 40's mpgs going into Maryville on 411 with the speed control on 50, but that's kind of cheating, can't do it for a whole tank of gas.

[KingJL]

You are the first person I have noticed that is getting the advertised 47 mpg for the new 13. I have a friend in Tellico Village with a Prius, and he says he gets about 44 when he drives and 41 when his wife drives. So you are doing real good. How many miles do you have now, and how much has been high speed highway driving? I can get high 40's mpgs going into Maryville on 411 with the speed control on 50, but that's kind of cheating, can't do it for a whole tank of gas.

 

9400 mi. Lifetime 44.1 mpg ( never reset... Was 16 when I got it). 10 - 15% of the miles are intersrate... The rest are our roads around the area; rt 39 to Athens, 411 to Maryville, 68 to Sweetwater, 72 & 444 to Lenoir City, US 11 into Knoxville. From home (8 mi south of Madisonville in Laurel Mtn Lakes) I set the cc to 57 and leave it there except thru Madisonville and Vonore where I set it at 50. Occasionally I may go to Knoxville thru Maryville via the Pelissippi wherebthe cc is set to 67-68. My typical trip is 65 to 115 mi round trip. Very few short trips into Madisonville. Usually it is to Athens, Maryville, or Knoxville. If I don't touch the interstate and do not have much in the way of headwinds I can get 47.5 - 48.5 mpg per tank, but usually end up with 46.5 - 47.5. Short trips into Madisonville (15 mi round trip) results in about 44 mpg this time of the year.

[tr7driver]

I will be gone over 3 weeks, so I think I will trickle charge the 12V battery. Not able to do that with the Mustang, since I only have 1 charger. I can always charge that battery when I get back, since I won't need it the day we return. It does have a new Fomoco battery too.

My mustang battery would be flat dead after 3 week due to all the accessories that still draw current when it is off. If I Disconnect the battery it will hold a charge.

Edited September 27, 2013 by tr7driver

[VonoreTn]

My mustang battery would be flat dead after 3 week due to all the accessories that still draw current when it is off. If I Disconnect the battery it will hold a charge.

Don't feel bad about that, I have several friends who have multiple cars that they leave in their second homes, and I have learned that even the expensive luxury car manuals recommend that for extended storage, either disconnect the battery or put a battery tender on it. Car computers require some small current to maintain the anti-theft function, and the computer memories hence there is always a small drain on modern cars. I wouldn't recommend a constant feed trickle charger, because a constant low current, even only 1/2 an amp is also hard on the battery. A good battery tender, that shuts off at a specified high voltage, maybe 13 volts, and then turns on again at ~12.3, is a better way to maintain a healthy battery.

[dalesky]

My mustang battery would be flat dead after 3 week due to all the accessories that still draw current when it is off. If I Disconnect the battery it will hold a charge.

I put a trickle charger on until I got a new proper Ford battery. Now it holds a charge for over 2 weeks just fine. Haven't tested it beyond that yet.

Edited September 28, 2013 by dalesky

[MXGOLF]

My main big battery does not hold a charge. It can be almost fully charged at night and the next morning its way low. Bad battery possibly? It seems when I am in EV mode it drains pretty rapidly but I don't have anything to compare it to.

[GrySql]

My main big battery does not hold a charge. It can be almost fully charged at night and the next morning its way low. Bad battery possibly? It seems when I am in EV mode it drains pretty rapidly but I don't have anything to compare it to.

That doesn't sound quite right, mine is approx the same SOC the next morning.

 

I've always thought that my HVB was sub-standard so I questioned my Service Advisor about that, he had the Tech check it while doing the PCM Update.

The Tech said that all he could do is have his computer query the car's computer for the HVB's status. Apparently, there is a special HVB software that constantly monitors the HVB and if anything abnormal happens it will send an Alert. My HVB's system advised the Ford Tech's computer that it was within normal parameters, meaning that there was nothing he could do.

 

There was a Lincoln Hybrid in a service bay getting an entire new HVB package so I wandered over and looked at that process and was shoo'ed out.

That is a big battery, shipped in a wonderfully crafted wooden shipping crate. I asked my SA about that.

He said the MKZ had the HVB Alert, went into limp mode and then the battery shut the car down and would not let it move. Hence, the new HVB battery pack.

[corncobs]

My main big battery does not hold a charge. It can be almost fully charged at night and the next morning its way low. Bad battery possibly? It seems when I am in EV mode it drains pretty rapidly but I don't have anything to compare it to.

I totally agree with GrySql that doesn't sound right at all.

 

For me my HVB SOC is usually slightly higher in morning than when a shut it off the night before. In afternoon when leaving work the SOC is quite a bit higher it seems the HVB "relaxes" a bit remembering the true SOC while waiting for me to finish work.

 

How is your 12V battery? Maybe the HVB relay is not getting disconnected after shut down and now draining the HVB.

[hybridbear]

My main big battery does not hold a charge. It can be almost fully charged at night and the next morning its way low. Bad battery possibly? It seems when I am in EV mode it drains pretty rapidly but I don't have anything to compare it to.

The SOC shouldn't really change while the car is off as it is disconnected. It's possible that your battery is within the parameters of the computer so it doesn't throw a code, but that doesn't mean that it's performing at an optimal level.

[acdii]

My main big battery does not hold a charge. It can be almost fully charged at night and the next morning its way low. Bad battery possibly? It seems when I am in EV mode it drains pretty rapidly but I don't have anything to compare it to.

Take a picture when you shut it down, and one when you start it up, print them out, date them and do this a few times. Then take it to the dealer with photographic proof. If you still have issues, then escalate. That does not sound right at all.

 

Once disconnected there should be no bleed down, in fact, just like CC mentioned, when the batteries cool down and the excitement stops, the SOC usually goes up. I can take my Lipo packs, run my plane, and drain them down to about 3.5 v per cell, let them cool and when I check them later on they have gained about .2 v per cell back. I flew a couple weeks back and I know I drained 2 packs down to 3.4, thats where I set my cutoff alarm. I didnt charge them right away, so they sat, this past weekend I put them on the charger and they both recovered to 3.7v per cell.

[B25Nut]

I just left my FFH in the long term parking at our airport for seven days. I left it with a 80%+ HVB SOC. When I started it up this afternoon, it was at 95%+.

[acdii]

I just left my FFH in the long term parking at our airport for seven days. I left it with a 80%+ HVB SOC. When I started it up this afternoon, it was at 95%+.

Welcome back!

 

It was a pleasure meeting you and the wife the other day, and I extremely appreciate the gift. :) It was great that you got to meet Mike and Chris, as you can tell Mike loves talking about warbirds. Keep me updated on that project you have going too, will be interesting to see it "take off".