Want vs Need

[acdii]

I was watching Sunday Morning and it was mostly about financial stories, but there was one story that really got me thinking once again(OW MY HEAD, Whats that smoke I'm smelling) Want verse Need.

 

What is was about is, do you spend money on want items, and spend all you make, or do you spend it on needs and put the rest away.

 

Well now that I look at it, and gave it some thought my recent car decision was based more on WANT than NEED. I did need to reduce my monthly car payment, but did I really Need another hybrid to do it? Answer came back as no. Reason being, now when I need to get items I would normally have used the Pickup or Flex for I now have to do one of two things. Take two vehicles, which now results in burning twice as much fuel, which is equal to what I would have burned in the truck or Flex, or renting a pickup, which requires me to now drive at least 15 miles to get it, load it up, drive it home, unload it, drive it back and now drive back again, using, guess what, twice as much fuel. So much for gas savings.

 

So my next recent decision was to get what I truly WANT, the HyTi. But, do I truly NEED it. Again, the answer to this is No! I don't need to have a really nice car with a good sound system, that gets over 40 MPG. I already have a car that has a really good sound system that can get over 40 MPG.

 

Another thought that came up, in order for me to handle some of the basics that I did with the Flex, like get the horse food once a month, picking up larger items that didnt fit in the car, etc. I would need to get a small enclosed trailer, do do so I would also need to install a hitch on one of the cars, so for that, and the cost of the trailer, I now am looking to spend another $2000 or so. I would also need to install a class III on the MGM and upgrade the cooling systems, install trailer harness and brake controller, and that is about another $500. So to fix the Need, there is another $2500.

 

So Want vs Need. Do I Need a new HyTi? Simple answer is No. Do I Want a new HyTi, Hell Yes I do! Do I need a Utility Vehicle, answer turns out to be yes. Do I need a new one? No. So what do I Need. After much thought and talking with my wife on this, the answer unfortunately, and probably the wisest one is, We need to get another Flex, and get rid of the Fusion altogether. I know my dealer will hate me after this, but I feel I wasn't treated as fairly as I thought I was. I will just take my business elsewhere, best offer gets the deal. I really didn't Need the F150, but I did Need the Flex, and as I found out too late, getting rid of the one I had was the biggest mistake I made in the past 10 years. The biggest one of all time was buying this damned house!

 

Keeping the current Fusion is not going to happen, I don't trust it, plain and simple, so best to cut my losses on it now while I can seems to be the best thing I can do at this point.

 

I dont know which is tougher, trying to make the right decision here, or having kids. Want verses Need. Really gives food for thought. In the long run, which will be better? Fusion, or Flex? Ideally keeping the new Fusion, and trading the old for the flex would be good, however too great a loss on the old Fusion, and why get rid of a car that has been good for us so far. So I give up Adaptive Cruise, do I need it or do I want it. Answer, want, dont need. Auto highbeams, rain sensing wipers, Want or Need, again, dont need. BLIS, well that one is tough, I truly do use it, and cross traffic alert is very handy, but do I need it? No, I know how to use my mirrors and since I am primary driver, it's not a need.

 

However, nothing can replace the Awesome factor of the New Fusion, and that is one thing I will truly regret not having if I go the Need vs Want route. By going the Flex route, depending on what I find, I can reduce our expenses enough to offset the additional fuel costs with room left over. The downside is, no warranty, and higher mileage on the vehicle. The plus side, dont need an additional trailer, I have one that the Flex can pull, but the cars cant, so that eliminates $2500 from being spent, along with the added cost of licensing and insurance.

 

So, any thoughts on this? I want and need input. :)

Edited March 24, 2013 by acdii

[ace8726872]

I was watching Sunday Morning and it was mostly about financial stories, but there was one story that really got me thinking once again(OW MY HEAD, Whats that smoke I'm smelling) Want verse Need.

 

What is was about is, do you spend money on want items, and spend all you make, or do you spend it on needs and put the rest away.

 

Well now that I look at it, and gave it some thought my recent car decision was based more on WANT than NEED. I did need to reduce my monthly car payment, but did I really Need another hybrid to do it? Answer came back as no. Reason being, now when I need to get items I would normally have used the Pickup or Flex for I now have to do one of two things. Take two vehicles, which now results in burning twice as much fuel, which is equal to what I would have burned in the truck or Flex, or renting a pickup, which requires me to now drive at least 15 miles to get it, load it up, drive it home, unload it, drive it back and now drive back again, using, guess what, twice as much fuel. So much for gas savings.

 

So my next recent decision was to get what I truly WANT, the HyTi. But, do I truly NEED it. Again, the answer to this is No! I don't need to have a really nice car with a good sound system, that gets over 40 MPG. I already have a car that has a really good sound system that can get over 40 MPG.

 

Another thought that came up, in order for me to handle some of the basics that I did with the Flex, like get the horse food once a month, picking up larger items that didnt fit in the car, etc. I would need to get a small enclosed trailer, do do so I would also need to install a hitch on one of the cars, so for that, and the cost of the trailer, I now am looking to spend another $2000 or so. I would also need to install a class III on the MGM and upgrade the cooling systems, install trailer harness and brake controller, and that is about another $500. So to fix the Need, there is another $2500.

 

So Want vs Need. Do I Need a new HyTi? Simple answer is No. Do I Want a new HyTi, Hell Yes I do! Do I need a Utility Vehicle, answer turns out to be yes. Do I need a new one? No. So what do I Need. After much thought and talking with my wife on this, the answer unfortunately, and probably the wisest one is, We need to get another Flex, and get rid of the Fusion altogether. I know my dealer will hate me after this, but I feel I wasn't treated as fairly as I thought I was. I will just take my business elsewhere, best offer gets the deal. I really didn't Need the F150, but I did Need the Flex, and as I found out too late, getting rid of the one I had was the biggest mistake I made in the past 10 years. The biggest one of all time was buying this damned house!

 

Keeping the current Fusion is not going to happen, I don't trust it, plain and simple, so best to cut my losses on it now while I can seems to be the best thing I can do at this point.

 

I dont know which is tougher, trying to make the right decision here, or having kids. Want verses Need. Really gives food for thought. In the long run, which will be better? Fusion, or Flex? Ideally keeping the new Fusion, and trading the old for the flex would be good, however too great a loss on the old Fusion, and why get rid of a car that has been good for us so far. So I give up Adaptive Cruise, do I need it or do I want it. Answer, want, dont need. Auto highbeams, rain sensing wipers, Want or Need, again, dont need. BLIS, well that one is tough, I truly do use it, and cross traffic alert is very handy, but do I need it? No, I know how to use my mirrors and since I am primary driver, it's not a need.

 

However, nothing can replace the Awesome factor of the New Fusion, and that is one thing I will truly regret not having if I go the Need vs Want route. By going the Flex route, depending on what I find, I can reduce our expenses enough to offset the additional fuel costs with room left over. The downside is, no warranty, and higher mileage on the vehicle. The plus side, dont need an additional trailer, I have one that the Flex can pull, but the cars cant, so that eliminates $2500 from being spent, along with the added cost of licensing and insurance.

 

So, any thoughts on this? I want and need input. :)

 

Hi acdii, I feel your pain brother. I am not smart enough or lucky enough to be financially independent. Just an average guy who lives from paycheck to paycheck, trying my best to provide for the family and hope to retire at some point period. So we both have to make lots of choice and most of the times, our NEEDS will win out over our WANTS.

 

Based on what you said, I would have to agree with you that you should go with the FLEX and say goodbye to your FUSION. It's really hard because we are only human and want to do things that make us happy. However, being a man and a head of your household with all the responsibilities that go along with it, it shows maturity and character on your part, asking yourself the right questions and coming up with the right answers. I am sure your family loves you for your sacrifice and selfless love.

[acdii]

Yeah, been searching just the right one with the features I need and the price to match. It must have Ecoboost, the NA 3.5 wont have the guts to pull my horse trailer. SO that isnt a want as much as a need. It doesn't need to be a Limited, but it seems they are whats out there. I found one just a bit ago in Kansas that is just like the one I got rid of but in Limited with the trailer tow. I sent them an email to see what they can do. I know my kids will be thrilled, they loved Cinny, which is what we called the Flex, it was Cinnamon with a white roof. My son likes the blue car, and will be grumpy cat when it goes.

 

Right now I have 3 prospects I am working on, one is near me, if you consider 100 miles near. I noticed the price has dropped over $1000 on it since the first time I saw it, and wondering why it is still unsold. There is another one that is about the same distance, in White that is more expensive, with lower miles, and a third one that is in Kansas that has only 25K miles on it. So there is a range of about $3000 between them the lowest having 46K on it. The Kansas one also has a 2013, but not EB nor with the tow package, but has 18K miles and is selling for under $30K. If it had the tow package I would give that one major consideration. I could add a hitch, but the wiring isnt there, and is a major undertaking to put the trailer and brake controller wiring in, I attempted it in the one I had, and had to remove all the trim panels to do it, I only got one side done, and never finished the job, so I never had a chance to try it out.

 

I will see what they come back with on these and see how far I have to drive. Overall I feel like this is the right way to go, I really Want that Fusion HyTi, but We really dont Need it.

 

In a few more years when the 2010 has come towards its retirement age, I will most likely get another one, so I think a few years of longing will eventually pay off.

[ketel0ne]

It's amazing when our needs outweigh our wants and really make the money we have already spent a non factor. We all have to live the decisions we make. I have never had a car for more than 2.5 years and never had less than 3 cars at anyone time in the last 20 years. The stable over the last 8 years just gets more expensive based on wants and very little on needs,

In 2005 (1996 Geo Metro, 1979 F-150 4x4, 1993 Ford Explorer, 2002 mustang)

In 2007 (2007 yaris, 2002 mustang, 1993 ford explorer)

In 2009 (2007 Ford escape hybrid, 2002 mustang, 1994 corvette)

 

Left the land of economy and logic

In 2010 (2010 Camaro, 2002 mustang, 2010 F-150 STX)

In 2011 (2010 Camaro, 2011 Challenger, 2010 F-150 FX4)

 

In 2013 (2013 Fusion Hybrid, 2011 Challenger, 2010 F-150 FX4)

 

At least all car decisions are reversible, they are just costly.

Edited March 24, 2013 by ketel0ne

[ace8726872]

Very nice collection ketelOne. I especially like how you have hybrids and muscle cars at the same time, to even things out!!! Very nice indeed!

[ketel0ne]

Very nice collection ketelOne. I especially like how you have hybrids and muscle cars at the same time, to even things out!!! Very nice indeed!

 

Thanks, I guess it also balanced out the want and needs as well. My wife puts between 40k-50k a year on the collective, so usually the one with good economy is quite well used 2.5 years in. The Camaro and The Challenger for the last 2 years have not meet the need. So the Camaro lost out.

[HenryVIII]

Acdii, I understand your situation. It's only a question that you can answer. I will give you my situation. I'm looking at moving down from 2 vehicles to one. Things are are getting serious with my gf and I may be moving in to help her out. It's hard to have 2 cars as parking is limited and no garage available either. So I'm looking to move down to 1 car. So I have to put aside my wants (owning 2 cars) over my needs. Originally I was going to get a hybrid to complement my 275 hp Cougar. So I figured a 240 hp Fusion Ti would be a nice compromise.

 

If you don't require having to drive a truck very often you can always look into picking up a used truck for cheap. That way you can keep what you WANT. Food for thought and options you can consider.

[acdii]

Been doing more looking, found a couple MKT's too that might be doable, all boils down to what they are willing to give on the Fusion. If I can swing the MKT it will fill the gap between want and need. The only thing that I will give up then is the Hybrid and newness of the car.

 

Ever since I traded the Flex and F350 in on the F150 I was thinking, did I do the right thing, then when I traded the F150 for the Fusion, I thought I did the right thing, then the troubles with it began and all that went out the window, and the discovery of just how much I actually used the Flex really hit home, and then I was back to, did I do the right thing, and apparently it was not.

 

I will say that I will envy all who have the new Fusion, it really is a great car, and I would love to keep it instead of the 2010, but I owe too much on that one to make it possible. Besides its the wifes car, and she likes it, and has her Frog on it, so I cant take that away from her.

[ace8726872]

Hey, I didn't realize that the 3.5 liter EcoBoost engine that you can get in the Flex has 355 HP / 350 ft-lbs. I suddenly don't feel so bad for you now! :-)

 

 

[acdii]

Hey, I didn't realize that the 3.5 liter EcoBoost engine that you can get in the Flex has 355 HP / 350 ft-lbs. I suddenly don't feel so bad for you now! :-)

LOL, yeah, but that 355HP can suck gas through a firehose when you put it to use! Believe me, I put mine through use :shift: more than a few times. If I do get one of these, first thing I will do is upgrade the brakes, they were the Achilles heel on the one I had, they would heat up quickly and fade. It wont be driven enough for gas to be of concern, I usually only drive it one day a week or if we all go out somewhere, or take a trip. If the one I have in mind works out, then the difference in monthly payments will make up for the difference in gas, and be a wash.

 

Still on the fence here on this, but once I hear from the feelers I put out yesterday I should have a clearer idea on what I should do.

[rjent]

I will be brutal here. LOL.

 

As soon as you said horses, you lost me as far as want vs need. I grew up on a cattle ranch in New Mexico. I am just a farm kid that turned high tech professionally. I never lost the farm boy outlook on life and I feel it has payed me well over the years. I grew up with a string of horses that we used as tools. Yes I had my favorites and if I went fishing in the Gila Wilderness, I had one mare that I would always take, lots of spirit and strenght, but would try to sleep in my sleeping bag with me like a dog if I let her. I have always lived frugally, watched my expenses (farm boy training) and lived comfortably without a lot of bling. I bought a lot of new Fords, but again as tools. My only vise was classic Corvettes, which I still have, but I am not losing money on them, instead making with inflation and appreciation.

 

Now with all that said, unless you are using your horses as tools, you are throwing away more money than you can imagine. I am not being critical brother, but don't fool yourself, horses are a ridiculously expensive vice and I don't care what your reasons are, that is just a fact. We are looking at 5 dollars or more per gallon gasoline, possibly even this year. Our leaders are telling us that taxes are probably going up my orders of magnitude, etc. Bottom line, a new FFH is maybe a tool that will be nice to have around in a year or so.

 

Anyway, just my two cents.

 

Really think about what your priorities are, like you alluded to in Want vs. Need. But do it over the whole spectrum.....

Edited March 25, 2013 by rjent

[acdii]

I would like nothing more than to get rid of the horses, get rid of this hell hole of a house and get the hell out of this hell hole of a state! In a sense though the horses have become a tool, in that it is teaching responsibility to my kids, in their taking care of them and in training them to ride. Up until recently when we ran out of hay, there is a huge shortage of it now from the drought, they were costing us about $250 a month to feed, so the expenses were not too bad for them, but when we ran out of hay and haven't been able to stock up on it, the costs have about tripled, and they are putting a hurt on. We usually get by with about $700 a year in hay costs, but haven't been able to find any.

 

Yeah, I do see your point, they cost us about $4000 a year in upkeep. They had cost us a whole lot more when we were boarding them, more like $14,000 a year, so by having them on our own property is saving about $10K a year or more, much more when you consider traveling and gas to get to and from the stable.

 

Any way I look at it though, we still Need a 5 passenger vehicle, and the cars just cant cut it when the kids are still in car seats, the back seats just aren't wide enough and seat belt placement I found is crucial, I couldn't tell you how many we looked at where the middle seat belt was under the car seat, or the persons butt. I looked at the Explorer, Edge, and Escape and none of them had a back seat with enough room, the Explorer did have a 3rd row, but I did not like the vehicle, I had a 97 and hated it. The Fusion back seat is barely adequate, my wife gets wedged between the car seats and her shoulders rub against the tops of the car seats, and we have the smallest ones around.

 

I am trying every thing I can think of to make the Fusion work for us, but there are just too many negatives for it to be feasible. However I do appreciate your opinion and advice on this. Thanks.

[rjent]

Like I said, not being critical. Just trying to give a helpful observation. I only meant it as seeing through a fresh pair of eyes .... :)

I would like nothing more than to get rid of the horses, get rid of this hell hole of a house and get the hell out of this hell hole of a state! In a sense though the horses have become a tool, in that it is teaching responsibility to my kids, in their taking care of them and in training them to ride. Up until recently when we ran out of hay, there is a huge shortage of it now from the drought, they were costing us about $250 a month to feed, so the expenses were not too bad for them, but when we ran out of hay and haven't been able to stock up on it, the costs have about tripled, and they are putting a hurt on. We usually get by with about $700 a year in hay costs, but haven't been able to find any.

 

Yeah, I do see your point, they cost us about $4000 a year in upkeep. They had cost us a whole lot more when we were boarding them, more like $14,000 a year, so by having them on our own property is saving about $10K a year or more, much more when you consider traveling and gas to get to and from the stable.

 

Any way I look at it though, we still Need a 5 passenger vehicle, and the cars just cant cut it when the kids are still in car seats, the back seats just aren't wide enough and seat belt placement I found is crucial, I couldn't tell you how many we looked at where the middle seat belt was under the car seat, or the persons butt. I looked at the Explorer, Edge, and Escape and none of them had a back seat with enough room, the Explorer did have a 3rd row, but I did not like the vehicle, I had a 97 and hated it. The Fusion back seat is barely adequate, my wife gets wedged between the car seats and her shoulders rub against the tops of the car seats, and we have the smallest ones around.

 

I am trying every thing I can think of to make the Fusion work for us, but there are just too many negatives for it to be feasible. However I do appreciate your opinion and advice on this. Thanks.

[acdii]

Like I said, not being critical. Just trying to give a helpful observation. I only meant it as seeing through a fresh pair of eyes .... :)

Oh please dont take it wrong, I really do appreciate what you said, and it does make a lot of sense. Like I said, wish I could but they are part of the family and not owned by me alone. Oh man there are a ton of things I would like to do, but I have others to consider too.

[acdii]

Crikies! OK what a way to dampen ones spirits. I was offered $26K for the Fusion! WHAT?!?!?! $10K depreciation in under 4 months? EESH maybe my dealer is doing good on his offer after all!

 

One dealer down, still waiting on replies from others. Not going to add miles to the cars on a maybe thats for sure.

[acdii]

OK, 2 down, the one down south of me is a Buyback that had the engine replaced at 9K miles. They only offered 27500 for the Fusion. Pass. Not looking good, guess the HyTi is going to be the best offer yet. We shall see.

 

However, I just saved us $400 a year by switching to Gieco.

 

 

And that is not a joke, now if I can only find a lower insurance on our house, not many companies cover it due to the barn and zoning.

[tr7driver]

Call Country Financial. They specialize in farms. Bundle the house, barn and car and you should save a bunch

[RedLdr1]

Crikies! OK what a way to dampen ones spirits. I was offered $26K for the Fusion! WHAT?!?!?! $10K depreciation in under 4 months? EESH maybe my dealer is doing good on his offer after all!

 

One dealer down, still waiting on replies from others. Not going to add miles to the cars on a maybe thats for sure.

 

I hate to tell you but that sounds about right... "Trade In" value is usually detemined using the Mannheim Report by most dealers, it is a report on the "wholesale auction" value of the vehicle and is significantly less than Blue Book / Black Book / Edmunds and all the other useless value guides you can access on the web. When a vehicle is realitively new there isn't a lot of data in the Mannheim Report and the pricing can be low... Add in they include a lot of used rental units and repos and it can get really low...

 

We tried out a 2011 Hyundai Sonata Hybrid and it just didn't work out for us. It's MSRP was $34,000....I got $25,000 Trade In. That is a $9,000 hit over three months based on the cars supposed value. The Sales Manager at my Ford dealership showed me the Mannheim Report printouts and that is what they were selling for... The good news is my son works for Hyundai and I only paid his employee pricing of $25,500 for the car...so I paid $500 to use the car for three months. I was very lucky on that one...

[ketel0ne]

My most economical hauling solution was a harbor freight 4x8 trailer and my 2007 escape hybrid. It took 2 trips sometimes based on weight but there was nothing at home depot I couldn't get home and still get over 30mpg. Couldn't do a horse trailer of course but since the trailer weighs less than 300lbs and with 12 inch wheels it would be right around 1000lbs for total weight and that was the towing limit for the truck. I also got the escape with 5k miles on it in 2007 for $25k.

Edited March 25, 2013 by ketel0ne

[acdii]

Well, looks like I will stick with my original plans of listing the car, seeing if it sells, and if not go for the deal we made with my dealer and hope for the best. If it sells then I am free and clear to get what I need. It posted today but the price got goobered, it was supposed to be 33900 and it is listing at 38900. Not sure how that happened!

[storksb]

acdii,

 

I have read many of your posts here. Seems like you have quite a quandary. Maybe there is a third option that you have not considered. You mention that you need to have a larger vehicle maybe a couple of times a month for hauling larger items and horse feed, so how about buying a 10+ year old f150? You could pick one up relatively cheap, it would be inexpensive to run for the limited use etc, probably cheaper than the loss you'll take on the FFH.

 

storksb

[HenryVIII]

acdii,

 

I have read many of your posts here. Seems like you have quite a quandary. Maybe there is a third option that you have not considered. You mention that you need to have a larger vehicle maybe a couple of times a month for hauling larger items and horse feed, so how about buying a 10+ year old f150? You could pick one up relatively cheap, it would be inexpensive to run for the limited use etc, probably cheaper than the loss you'll take on the FFH.

 

storksb

 

I actually recommended this to him as well. If he's not going to use the truck that often, get a used one for cheap! There's plenty of used trucks available.

[acdii]

This is what I had before, 3 vehicles, 3 on insurance, 3 to tag. Since I rarely used the f350 it was one less that I had to pay for to have sit. Looking back, the mistake I made was getting rid of the F350 and the Flex, and should have sold the F350 outright and kept the Flex.

 

However, had I done that I never would have had the chance to Enjoy how the new Fusion drives and handles on the Interstate.

 

I have had 2 responses so far to my Cars.com add, so there is hope that I can sell it outright. This frees me up to either, get a much better deal on the HyTi, and if that falls through then I can focus on finding just the right vehicle for us.

 

I was even giving consideration on finding a Diesel Excursion, small consideration, but one nonetheless.

 

New Pic

Edited March 28, 2013 by acdii

[acdii]

Been a resourceful week and after cutting $400 a year on insurance, and refinancing my 2010, I now can better afford the HyTi. Since the trade offers were so very low on the 13, and chances of selling the car for a decent enough price are slim, the offer the dealer gave me on the HyTi turned out to be below Invoice with my trade, so looks like it will be the best deal. I also restructured a few other bills and have a much better balanced budget. Too bad our government cant do the same thing.

[rjent]

I knew you would get it worked out. I wonder what will happen to your old Fusion. Do you think Ford will "dissect" it?