Cold weather/Warm weather

[djminfll]

Living year round in Fort Lauderdale, FL, I don't deal with cold weather very much, so until now, I couldn't contribute to the cold weather mpg discussions. However, we had a cold weekend (cold for FL, not really cold!)with temps in the 50s and I definitely saw a dip in the fuel economy. The car did not start off in EV mode, stayed in gas mode for longer, and when it did go to EV, it didn't stay in it as long. This fill-up average on the screen dropped from almost 44 to about 39 mpg. So for all of you who are experiencing disappointing mpg figures, don't despair, spring is right around the corner!

[expresspotato]

Yup - we all know it... But what will Ford do about it?

[B25Nut]

"But what will Ford do about it?"

 

What is this supposed to mean? Most hybrids get lower mileage during winter. If the FFH had been released in March last year, our discussions would be about why our cars aren't getting as good of mileage as they initially did.

[Fynack]

"But what will Ford do about it?"

 

What is this supposed to mean? Most hybrids get lower mileage during winter. If the FFH had been released in March last year, our discussions would be about why our cars aren't getting as good of mileage as they initially did.

Would have been nice if the dealer or Ford stated this for first time hybrid buyers. Instead just saying oh ""youll get 47 all the time, its incredible what it can do"" As for what they can do, they could provide block heaters, program the shutters to close completely during winter, provide driving techniques if they want to blame the driver. Try try try something.

[tombarker13ffh]

All cars get worse mpg in winter. Thats part of normal ICE operation. Today the temp was 39 and this what i got on my work commute with a cold start. Much better!

[expresspotato]

Yeah but worse than a conventional car?

[tombarker13ffh]

Well considering cold oil and engine parts take more energy to move and the ICE on a hybrid will run less and lose engine temp on top of having to drive a generator along with wheels, one would think at least the ICE operation in a hybrid would on average be less efficient than conventional car powertrains, but the hybrid drive assistance and pure electric modes, and the atkinson style internals make the hybrid powertrain more efficient than normal gas engines anyway. The cold just makes the hybrid not as efficient as the hybrid can be when warm. So is a hybrid more affected by cold than a normal engine? I would say no. My Mustang could do like 24 mpg in the cold and like 34 mpg in the warm. Am i seeing that kind of loss in my FFH? No.

[acdii]

The 2010 is affected only in I lose less than 5 MPG on the coldest days, and gets very close to warm weather MPG above 20*, above 50* it gets over EPA. This of course is when I drive it to get it, but usually I just drive it and get what it gets. 35 in Winter, 40 in Summer. So far my summer/winter driving is about 38. I excluded the first winter from Fueleconomy.gov because of a bad map sensor and related poor MPG, which is what is posted below for lifetime. It's 38 on the FE.G site. Total lifetime on Fuelly.

[mokee]

Don't forget about the so called "winter blend." My mpg always goes down when the refiners in my area switch to "winter blend" and improves when they switch back. On my travels, I also experienced better mileage in states like Wisconsin or Florida where I found more stations selling E0 as opposed to those states that offered primarily E10. Straight gas has more BTUs than E10.

[ace8726872]

So,I have a question. I live in LA where the summer temperatures can and often do reach 100F and more during summer months. I keep hearing that the MPG will get better when it gets warmer. My question is whether there is an upper temperature limit where the MPG suffers above that point?

 

Thanks.

[acdii]

Only if you use the AC. If you can suffer through the heat without it, then the MPG shouldnt suffer. At least our 2010 doesn't, who knows how it affect the 13, the difference between the two in cold is drastic. We should find out within the next few months as spring comes and so does the heat.

[ptjones]

So,I have a question. I live in LA where the summer temperatures can and often do reach 100F and more during summer months. I keep hearing that the MPG will get better when it gets warmer. My question is whether there is an upper temperature limit where the MPG suffers above that point? Thanks.

We have been wondering that for awhile now. Every time it hits 70deg i'm getting low 50'smpg so I'm thinking I'll hit 60mpg in the +80deg. Where does it stop? 65mpg at 100deg? no one knows yet.

The AC will have a factor in that and it runs off the battery.

[terryb]

There are also cooling requirements for the HVB pack. Tripple digits here in Houston last year had a noticable impact on mileage.

[tombarker13ffh]

Dont know how the heat will affect the battery but the recent 50-degree temps here seem to have made the battery last longer and give better hybrid drive results. One of my instructors at school drives a 95 geo metro and he gets 45 mpg in the winter and just shy of 70 in the hot hot. ICEs definitely like the heat, when fuel efficiency is the goal.

[jeff_h]

So,I have a question. I live in LA where the summer temperatures can and often do reach 100F and more during summer months. I keep hearing that the MPG will get better when it gets warmer. My question is whether there is an upper temperature limit where the MPG suffers above that point? Thanks.

 

In my experience, the MPG is good until it hits about 90 and then starts to go down from there, and the hot & humid days of 95-100+ were bigger killers. I observed that with the Prius and the 2010 FFH, both with the NiMH batteries -- from the posts I've seen on the 2013 from those living in the colder regions it appears that the Li-Ion batteries may hold more juice and perform better and all that, but it appears to me that they are also more volatile to the temperature changes.... so I'm also curious as to whether the really hot summers will have the same effect on the MPG or maybe take more of a hit with the Li-Ion, time will tell.

 

As an illustration of the MPG changes, below is the link to my 2010 FFH (now sold) page where I made 280 fill-ups... scroll down a little bit and you'll see the month-by-month graph and see the MPG hit from last July, which was quite a hot one in the DC area with several 100+ temperature days and sticky humidity too. And if you scroll down farther on that page you can scroll through at each fill-up and look for ones where the MPG took a dive that may have been related to temps. Note - fill-up that had another fill on the same or adjacent day were probably part of a road trip which normally had slightly lower MPGs, rather than due to temp changes.

 

https://www.fuelly.com/driver/jeffh/fusion

Edited March 10, 2013 by jeff_h

[ptjones]

In my experience, the MPG is good until it hits about 90 and then starts to go down from there, and the hot & humid days of 95-100+ were bigger killers. I observed that with the Prius and the 2010 FFH, both with the NiMH batteries -- from the posts I've seen on the 2013 from those living in the colder regions it appears that the Li-Ion batteries may hold more juice and perform better and all that, but it appears to me that they are also more volatile to the temperature changes.... so I'm also curious as to whether the really hot summers will have the same effect on the MPG or maybe take more of a hit with the Li-Ion, time will tell.

 

As an illustration of the MPG changes, below is the link to my 2010 FFH (now sold) page where I made 280 fill-ups... scroll down a little bit and you'll see the month-by-month graph and see the MPG hit from last July, which was quite a hot one in the DC area with several 100+ temperature days and sticky humidity too. And if you scroll down farther on that page you can scroll through at each fill-up and look for ones where the MPG took a dive that may have been related to temps. Note - fill-up that had another fill on the same or adjacent day were probably part of a road trip which normally had slightly lower MPGs, rather than due to temp changes.

 

https://www.fuelly.com/driver/jeffh/fusion

I'm not sure that you can compare FFH and CMAX to any other Hybrid especially because of Lithium-ion batt. Two to three months it will be in the 100's in Phoenix and we will see.

[jeff_h]

I'm not sure that you can compare FFH and CMAX to any other Hybrid especially because of Lithium-ion batt. Two to three months it will be in the 100's in Phoenix and we will see.

 

Yes sir, "so I'm also curious as to whether the really hot summers will have the same effect on the MPG or maybe take more of a hit with the Li-Ion, time will tell."

[acdii]

I dont know how much different Lion are to Lipo, but I know when its hot out, they have lower capacity. On a hot 95* day I have fewer flight minutes in my electrics than on a 70* day. I havent used the Lion packs in my 330L yet, so cant tell what their capacity it.

[tombarker13ffh]

Yesterday, 45°, 53.2 mpg. Today, 35°, 47.3 mpg.

 

 

[keybman]

In my experience, the MPG is good until it hits about 90 and then starts to go down from there, and the hot & humid days of 95-100+ were bigger killers. I observed that with the Prius and the 2010 FFH, both with the NiMH batteries -- from the posts I've seen on the 2013 from those living in the colder regions it appears that the Li-Ion batteries may hold more juice and perform better and all that, but it appears to me that they are also more volatile to the temperature changes.... so I'm also curious as to whether the really hot summers will have the same effect on the MPG or maybe take more of a hit with the Li-Ion, time will tell.

 

As an illustration of the MPG changes, below is the link to my 2010 FFH (now sold) page where I made 280 fill-ups... scroll down a little bit and you'll see the month-by-month graph and see the MPG hit from last July, which was quite a hot one in the DC area with several 100+ temperature days and sticky humidity too. And if you scroll down farther on that page you can scroll through at each fill-up and look for ones where the MPG took a dive that may have been related to temps. Note - fill-up that had another fill on the same or adjacent day were probably part of a road trip which normally had slightly lower MPGs, rather than due to temp changes.

 

https://www.fuelly.com/driver/jeffh/fusio

 

Was the hit on the MPG during July and August from the effect on the batteries or from using the air conditioner? (or both) I definitely have found that not using the heater during cool mornings helped to increase the MPG. But, I can't imagine being willing to sacrifice air conditioning when its 100 degrees outside, just for a few more MPGs. Somehow, I hope they cancel each other out.

[acdii]

AC does take a hit on MPG, but not too much, at least on the others I drove, wont know for a few months the impact on these. Hopefully nothing like how the cold impacts it. In my other car its about 2 MPG lower with AC on in city driving, highway though the wind drag with windows open is equal to the AC use, so its a wash.

[gadgetguy]

Ok so this is my worst mpg ever but short trip to get some lunch and the A/C was cranking trying to cool down the interior so the battery was draining as fast as the ICE could fill it lol...

[Guardian_Bob]

I think I got 3 something once, going between my driveway to my house and the driveway to my shop. Battery was drained, only had to go about 300 feet.

[fusionTX]

Ok so this is my worst mpg ever but short trip to get some lunch and the A/C was cranking trying to cool down the interior so the battery was draining as fast as the ICE could fill it lol...

That's funny. I had one of those last week. Well, almost as bad. Lunch trips and weekends hurt my MPG.