2013 Fusion Hybrid poor Fuel Economy issue

[acdii]

Or continue to blame the driver? That is the question here. Hopefully my woes with this new car and the trouble I have been going through will help others down the road who also have this problem.

 

As most on this forum know by now, as one person put, Infamous!, I have had poor gas mileage issues with my 2013 Fusion Hybrid. This is not my first Hybrid, as Ford would have me think in how they have responded to my complaints, but my fourth.

 

My first was a 2007 Prius, which I had for about a year, put 22K miles on it, but needed a bigger car. During the time I owned it, I achieved a 53 MPG lifetime average, with a trip to and from PA, which netted me 65 MPG highway, with a couple hundred mile stretch at 75 MPG. I have pictures somewhere of the display from that trip.

 

My second Hybrid was a Toyota Camry Hybrid, which we put about 32K miles on it until we had an issue with it, and it was during that time when Toyota was having issues with runaway cars, and ours was having this funky brake problem that could not be duplicated unless you drove it an exact distance and applied the brakes, and only on the one road we drove on. During that time we averaged 38 MPG in that car. It was rated at 34.

 

Our third Hybrid is a 2010 Fusion which we still own Thank the lord! We are averaging as you can see by me sig tags, 36.4, lifetime, two winters, one summer. It doesnt like the cold, but loves the summer, we get 34+ in winter, and 43 in the summer, and we just drive it, its shared between me and my wife, and we have different driving styles so our MMV. However, when we do drive it to maximize it, even when its 11* out we can still meet EPA combined of 39. When we first got the car it did good, around 38-40 as we learned the car, then it dropped like a rock, and set a check engine light. We bought the car used, with 800 miles on it, it had sat in a garage for at least 6 months, the original owner had passed away so it sat until the legal stuff was finished. It was in Iowa, so they had to pick it up and deliver it to IL. A MAP sensor had gone bad, spider got in it and clogged it up, and the entire system was reset, so it took a few thousand miles to correct itself, plus a few tanks of mid grade, then BOOM back up to where it should be, but that did bring the overall average down. When it started running right again, the average jumped from 32 to 38, then stayed there until we had our little cold snap of weeks below 20*. Overall we are very pleased with the car and can meet and exceed EPA! Most of our driving is rural highways at 55MPH, maybe 15% city 35-45 tops. That puts it right under combined of 39.

 

Now onto my new 2013 Fusion Hybrid. When I got it, I should have paid more attention during the test drive, as the MPG was not very good, even for it being brand new, it was around 32 during my test. I had previously test driven a Cmax that day, and got around 38. It was cold and windy, so I brushed it off to the weather. Well for the first week I did not go over 39 MPG in the car, then it started dropping a bit, and attributed it to the temps as it was after Thanksgiving and it was getting cold. Then I had to take a trip to Florida, we live near Rockford IL, so its a two day haul. I figured this would be a good break in drive for the car and I should get pretty good MPG, boy was I wrong.

 

I was averaging 300 miles per tank, with the Eco cruise set to 65, it barely touched 36 MPG, I dropped it down to 62 and barely got to 38. By the time I got to Florida I had already filled the car 4 times, the 2010 would have been 2 fills and consistent 38. When I finally got down there, the temp was 78*, and you would think perfect temps for high mileage, but again, not the case, I barely touched 38 the entire time. One one time did I see good mileage and that was during a city trip where we were traveling about 40 MPH with enough regen and soft lights to not have to stop, and not have to accelerate. I saw 50 for the first time over 9 miles, however, no HVAC was used.

 

On the trip back I ran tests over the first few hundred miles, temps mid 50s-60s, various speeds on the ACC, and at 55 MPH on a 70 MPH highway, it got 40, at 60 it got 38, 65 and above, 34. So basically the car was using too much fuel no matter how I drove it, Ecocruise, hypermiling, even drafting a flat bed semi like I did in the Prius to get 75 MPG had no affect. So the next week I dropped it off and asked they check the car out.

 

The service manager drove it home with his computed hooked up, and got 40-44 using eco cruise @ 55 MPH, and in the upper 30's driving manually up to 70 MPH. Ford said, no problem return car. Have customer learn how to drive. They didnt say it that way, but they had a bunch of links going to various things related to maximizing fuel economy, which to me mean exactly that, learn how to drive. A rep from Ford, named Sandy called me, and she basically told me the same thing, and when I mentioned I have no problem obtaining or exceeding the EPA in my 2010 Fusion Hybrid, she said irrelevant. When I said I have never had an issue meeting or exceeding EPA in any of my hybrids,again, irrelevant, its only an estimate, nothing wrong with the car.

 

Well, that was the first one. Then a week or so later, while pulling onto a highway, the check engine light started flashing and the car ran rough. After a few miles it cleared up, and the CEL turned off. The next turn and accelerate, it did it again. We got to where we were going, and did our thing(dinner), and on the trip home, no CEL, car ran OK. The next day on my way home from work, going up a hill, solid CEL, so I dropped it off at the dealer the next day. It took 3 days to get the car back, so now it has been out of service 5 days.

 

The CEL was caused by misfire due to all 4 spark plugs carbon fouling (see a pattern here?). The car has around 4500 miles on it by now. They replaced the plugs and test drove it again, and Ford told them, return the car, no problem found. :confused: For the first week I was Optimistic, did Ford get a bad batch of spark plugs? The car got 41 the next 2 days, then slowly dropped off. First two tanks, 39 MPG, 38 MPG, then it went off the cliff and was down in the low 30's once again. No check engine light, but I did ask to have the plugs checked which they did, and I can see carbon building up around the rim of the plug, nothing on the center or ground yet, but still a good layer of carbon, at least 1/64 of more was caked on the rim. For only having 900 miles of engine time, that to me was too much carbon, but the service manager thought other wise, but then again I didn't see the original plugs, so they probably look OK compared to those.

 

 

The poor fuel economy continues, no matter how I drive the car, like a granny, not exceeding 2000 RPM, maximizing EV, using Eco cruise, hypermiling, it still does poorly.

 

 

 

So now its back in for the third time, I have been hounding my dealer to get Ford to look at my car and fix or replace it, you know, the FORD thing, Fix or Replace Daily has become my motto to them. SO finally I get a call last Friday that a Ford engineer will be out Wednesday (today) to look at my car, so as I type this, the car is in the shop for the third time, day 6 out of service. During my time with the car since my last visit I picked up a ScanGauge ii, which many Prius owners swear by to achieve very high MPG in their cars, so I hooked it up and calibrated it per the manual , and the speed matched to GPS. I have found the trip to vary on each trip by as much as a 1/2 mile, and the MPG as much as 2 MPG. The accuracy of the scan gauge is under 2%, cant get much closer than that. I documented each trip, dash vs SG, and noted the max engine temps. A Cmax owner who frequents this board mentioned they block the grill which had me thinking back to my mechanic days, what happens if the engine is running cold, It burns more fuel(lightbulb), so I started watching the engine temps, and sure enough, this thing is COLD! For the majority of my drive, which is 55 MPH, the engine runs between 150-170* F, and only when I come to a stop light for more than 45 seconds does the temp reach 182*, unless I have full defrost, then it never goes that high. more like 170*. I put all my data on a spreadsheet, took photos of the dash and scan gauge as I could and sent them to my dealer.

So here is where it sits, Ford has my car now, they have my data, and if they ignore it, well, then they have a problem. They may think they are dealing with an average Joe who has no clue what a spark plug is to an O2 sensor, but they are dealing with someone who used to work as an ASE certified mechanic back in the mid 90's, when ODB2 came out, so I do know quite a bit about ignition, fuel, etc. I may not know much about Hybrid systems, but The Hybrid system is not the problem, the engine is.

Time will tell, hopefully I should hear something later today, but in the meantime, I wait.

Here is the Ironic part, the loaner they gave me is a Focus sedan, base model. I got 37 MPG in it this morning to work, same roads I take every day, and I get 3-4 MPG m0re in it than I do in my EPA rated 47 MPG Fusion. Last night on my way home from the gas station I go to, an 11.5 mile trip mostly at 55, I got 39 in it. I never got 39 in the Fusion on that trip.

I'm hoping this thread gets picked up on Google, hoping the thread title is going to do it.

Edited February 14, 2013 by acdii

[GrySql]

I know that took some time, nice summary. That brings us all up to date, thanks.

Ford Fusion Hybrid in the title may help with the search engine meta tag lookup.

(Using the Full Editor lets you change the title)

[hybrid47]

It is too bad that you are having to do the Ford mechanics work for them, but it sounds like you have narrowed down the problem to a probable cause. Since your vehicle is running cold, they should be checking your active grill shuttter first, since this is relatively easy to do, and is even something that could be checked at home when your vehicle is cold and first started (a flashlight and a quick check, looking through the front grill, would confirm that the shutters have closed). After that, the next two suspects would be the engine thermostat and the electric radiator cooling fan/switch combo. A thermostat that is stuck open (or missing) or a cooling fan that is always on, would also give you the cold engine symptoms (although I doubt that it is a fan problem, since your temperatures do rise once the vehicle is stopped for any time). I am surprised that the mechanics did not clue in on the fact that the engine was running cold, when they found all four of the spark plugs all carbonned up.

 

Thanks for keeping us in the loop on your Ford Fusion Hybrid problems, and please let us know what the mechanics ultimately find out.

[acdii]

Not good news, at least for me. Apperantly I can' t drive this like the others hybrids. I will give a full report when I am home.

[pers69]

Interested to hear the full report.

[acdii]

OK, here is the low down. There is another Hybrid owner who had his car built, and it arrived shortly after I picked up mine, and may have been built the week following mine, but cant confirm it. They test both cars, his has 17" mine 18" wheels. They put 100 or so miles on my car, drove each one multiple times and had their $40,000 laptop computer hooked up and both cars got MPG in the acceptable range that Ford set forth, which means anywhere between 39-44 MPG. Both cars fell right in. Mine a mile better than his, but mine has 4000 more miles on it. The other owner brought his in because he is not seeing good MPG either.

 

After talking to this engineer, and asking to explain the 128* temps, he had no answer, he wasn't there. They saw 198* temps during their tests, and they spent several hours in doing them. They did confirm the low temps when first driving it during the first hour, but was unconcerned about it. Their IDS does not have an interface for the shutters, so no clue, in fact the service manager had no idea what I was referring to, but the engineer did, and has no way to check them unless visual. They are supposed to close at highway speeds.

 

As far as they are concerned, there is nothing wrong with the car. OK prove it. He did. The car DOES get 40 MPG. He handed my ass to me.

 

Now get ready for HOW he did it.

 

Forget everything I know about driving all the other hybrids, this one cannot be driven that way. Basically in order for him to get 40 MPG the car has to be driven VERY slowly, Excruciating slow. Try 3 minutes to 60 MPH slow. Then back off to get into EV and stay on EV as long as possible, which means slowing down to 45 MPH. Then when down to 1/4 charge, SLOWLY return to 60 MPH, and do it all over again. IE EXTREME Pulse and Glide.

 

Can you say Road Rage? Yep we had been passed a few times and given the finger. But in the end over a 30 mile trip, the car read 41 MPG. So yes, I have not been driving this car correctly, I cannot drive it the same as my 2010 and expect 40 MPG. As further insult, drove to pick up the kids in my 2010, and got 40.7 MPG, driving normally. Picked up the kids, swapped to the loaner, picked up my 13, drove to the train station and picked up my wife, and then drove it exactly like he did. Got flipped off, took me almost twice as long to get home, got passed twice, but got 46 MPG.

 

In the end, no explanation for the fouled plugs, the cold temps are normal, and it has to be driven in an extreme manner to obtain decent fuel economy. So the question now is how much do I put my wife and myself and possibly my children at risk to get MPG in this car that I dont have to do in my older car?

 

This is the kind of driving a Prius owner does to get 90 MPG, and we have to do this in order to get 40? I basically told my saleman, that I am probably going to Toyota after this. At least when I get behind the wheel of one of their cars, I can get the EPA ratings without extreme hypermiling. Even with this kind of driving it cant get 47. Comes close, but cant get it. When I can exceed EPA in my other car without trying, well I dont know what to say.

 

If this is the manner in which the car has to be driven to obtain the expected range, that takes all the fun out of it, and becomes a chore, so basically we are going to get rid of it, and look elsewhere. Imagine if the 2010 were like this, it would be getting 27 MPG instead of 39. I am pretty much disgusted at this point, and feel like I got shafted big time by Ford. I would have been so much better off with a 2012 FFH, and saved a few grand for this kind of gas mileage without all the aggravation, or having to be one of "those" drivers.

 

At this point, more than likely this will be my last Ford, which is a shame, but F me once, shame on you, F me twice, and Adios. I have had problem vehicles from Ford, but they still lived up to what I paid for them for, but in this case, I did not get what I paid for, and basically have had enough. The one thing I could always count on with the Toyotas was getting good gas mileage and be truly reliable, regardless of the material quality. When I told my dealer this, he said he will call me tomorrow. For what purpose, I dont know, but I dont think there is a thing they can do to make this right. If it were the HyTi, with the nice Sony system, and a good working MFT, maybe I could have lived with it, but couple the crap for MPG and crap they call MFT, with no APPLINK for Pandora, and crappy sounding stereo, I no longer wish to own this car. Most likely going to sell or trade it as soon as I can before I put too many more miles on it, but with the price of gas going up, my original thoughts for an MKT or Flex are out the window, it is going to meed to be a car that gets good MPG with enough room for 2 adults plus me and 2 car seats, so we shall see.

[Riggo]

This is probably a really stupid question but here it goes anyway. Does the 2012 Fusion Hybrid have a turbo engine like the 2013 or no? I was thinking that if you drive like any normal person and press the pedal all the way down (or close to all the way down) when you start off the turbo kicks in, thus gas mileage is reduced (am I right on this or no?). So it sounds like you have to feather the pedal in the 2013 in order for the turbo to not kick in and to get better overall gas mileage. That would suck if true. I probably sounded like a total idiot with all of this but I was just seeing if this theory holds any water.

[GrySql]

A sad tale, especially when there are forum members here who are getting more than acceptable mileage without heroic driving discipline.

Your mental and financial situation because of this is deplorable and driving in that manner is wholly unrealistic.

 

A note on the 'behind the grille shutters'.

My weather was 50F this morning before I started the car, the shutters are completely open.

When I started the car a noticeable buzzing occurs at the front of the car, the shutter motor is closing the shutters to help warm the motor.

I watched it happen this morning. They went to the fully shut position.

Because of the milder weather my car warms up and will go into EV mode before I get to the freeway on-ramp that is 1.5 miles away.

 

Riggo, the Hybrid has a non-turbo 2.0L Atkinson 4-cylinder engine, not a normal Ford 4-cylinder 2.0L, very different.

[pers69]

Sorry, acdii. Look at the '14 Mazda6.

[nehmia]

This is probably a really stupid question but here it goes anyway. Does the 2012 Fusion Hybrid have a turbo engine like the 2013 or no? I was thinking that if you drive like any normal person and press the pedal all the way down (or close to all the way down) when you start off the turbo kicks in, thus gas mileage is reduced (am I right on this or no?). So it sounds like you have to feather the pedal in the 2013 in order for the turbo to not kick in and to get better overall gas mileage. That would suck if true. I probably sounded like a total idiot with all of this but I was just seeing if this theory holds any water.

 

There is no turbo in any generation Ford hybrid.

[terryb]

This is probably a really stupid question but here it goes anyway. Does the 2012 Fusion Hybrid have a turbo engine like the 2013 or no? I was thinking that if you drive like any normal person and press the pedal all the way down (or close to all the way down) when you start off the turbo kicks in, thus gas mileage is reduced (am I right on this or no?). So it sounds like you have to feather the pedal in the 2013 in order for the turbo to not kick in and to get better overall gas mileage. That would suck if true. I probably sounded like a total idiot with all of this but I was just seeing if this theory holds any water.

There is a boosted 2.0, but not in any of the hybrids.

[Riggo]

There is no turbo in any generation Ford hybrid.

And thus why that was an incredibly dumb question by me :confused:

[TX NRG]

Sorry to hear Ford wouldn't help you when it's clear there are problems w/ your and other's 2013 FFHs. Before throwing in the towel, or lodging the brick against the accelerator pedal before sending it over the cliff, think about asking your dealer to replace your thermostat at his cost and see if that solves your problem. Other rookie hybrid owners are getting a lot better MPG in normal carefree driving without resorting to those extreme hyper-miling tactics just to squeeze out 40MPG. Your car has a problem, and it may be cheaper to try a few things to fix it than bail to a 2nd/3rd choice vehicle and swallow the year 1 depreciation on the FFH.

[acdii]

Sorry, acdii. Look at the '14 Mazda6.

I just did, and will. 26 city 38 Highway, if it can get what I did in the Focus which is rated the same and the back seat has enough room, its a viable solution.

[acdii]

Sorry to hear Ford wouldn't help you when it's clear there are problems w/ your and other's 2013 FFHs. Before throwing in the towel, or lodging the brick against the accelerator pedal before sending it over the cliff, think about asking your dealer to replace your thermostat at his cost and see if that solves your problem. Other rookie hybrid owners are getting a lot better MPG in normal carefree driving without resorting to those extreme hyper-miling tactics just to squeeze out 40MPG. Your car has a problem, and it may be cheaper to try a few things to fix it than bail to a 2nd/3rd choice vehicle and swallow the year 1 depreciation on the FFH.

My dealer has gone overboard on this for me, and pushing it wont get it resolved. I am past the point of caring anymore, and had this gut feeling this is what would happen, and was prepared for it. Every mile added drops the value even more, and I pile on miles too fast, which is why I have been pushing on this. Every day I drive it reduces its value even more. May go out this weekend and look at the Mazda, dealer near my office has one with the options I like, but not in the color I would like, but it is still there to look at.

[GrySql]

Of course you are emotionally drained with this and I certainly don't blame you or want to add to that.

I'd just caution you to carefully reconsider buying another car that won't carry the horse food, whole family, tow a trailer, carry your RC's and other considerations that you have mentioned a few times here.

Maybe a non-hybrid $29k Honda CR-V AWD EX-L style vehicle (22/30/25 mpg) would serve you better for overall utility than another sedan like you already have.

I'll bet you could get something like that optioned out Honda SUV model which has really decent mpg's, is AWD, can use tire chains, has a spare tire, has famous reliability and is known to have a 4.5-star rating by it's customers.

It may not be as flashy but these new models are nice looking.

I think you'd be better served to have the flexibility that a mid-sized sedan doesn't have.

The cost differential may work in your favor too, I'll bet the FFH would get a nice trade-in against a vehicle like that, maybe a straight swap.

Just my 2¢... pardon if intruding.

 

 

Edit: the Honda iMid system streams Pandora, you can order a trailer hitch and even a tent if you want to.

Edited February 14, 2013 by GrySql

[ny2oc1996]

Wow, before you fall on your sword let’s make a real attempt to find out if you have a problem and what that problem is. Here is what I suggest. Go into your dealer and tell them that you would like their help with an experiment. You want to park your car there overnight preferably near one of their 2013 Fusion Hybrids.

 

Bright and early the next morning (Sunday?) you arrive and start your car and their 2013 hybrid. Now you will time how long each car takes to reach operating temperature and what that operating temperature is. While they are warming up, take note of the electric fan operation and the front shutters on both vehicles. Make sure the A/C and heat are off on both cars. You may even want to drive each one a couple of miles just to see if they are the same during and after. Maybe even drive two exits on a freeway with each if possible.

 

That should expose a cold engine problem if you have one. If you do have a cold engine problem compared to their hybrid and the electric fan and grille shutter operation was the same, thank them for their help and drive home. It’s time to test your thermostat. Being an ASE mechanic, you know the drill. For others reading this, remove the thermostat. At room temperature it should be completely closed. The thermostat should have the opening temperature stamped on it. If not, any shop manual or any auto parts store can give you that. Now place the thermostat in a pot of water on the stove with a thermometer and turn of the flame. When the thermometer reaches the rated opening temperature, the thermostat should be open. It’s imperative that the stat opens fully but in your cold running case we’re really looking for a partially stuck open thermostat at room temperature.

 

If the electric fan, grille shutters and stat all check out, then I would have any mechanic test your radiator cap. The cap puts the system under a designated pressure and has a relieve valve that opens when the pressure gets too high in an effort to maintain that designated operating pressure. Most good shops have a cap tester to test the pressure capability and the relieve function.

 

If your spark plugs were carbon fouled to the point that they were causing a misfire, then they had to be completely covered with black carbon soot. And that means the plates inside your catalytic converters and your oxygen sensors were/are covered with the same.

 

I would also pull one spark plug out of the 2010 hybrid just to see if there is any soot on the insulator indicating your weather and commute may be contributing to this scenario. In that case you may want to inquire with Ford about considering a different heat range spark plug.

 

Please, let’s try a little CPR before we throw our baby out.

[coach81]

wow.. so sorry A

[acdii]

You know the saying, time is money? I lack both! Already had a head to head comparison done against another Hybrid, they are identical. There are no other hybrids around here to test against, they had another customer bring his car in. Going to be putting another 62 miles on it today, dont have a choice since I have to get some T1's moved at 7AM, and usually on the road at tht time, so the wife is driving her car, so I have to take mine. Still trying to figure out how to mount a video camera to show the dash. I looked at alternatives last night online, Buick Enclave looks nice, and there is one just below it tht might suffice, rated between 26-38 MPG, same as the Focus I drove yesterday, if thats the case, getting 33 MPG in that would be fine.

 

Before I do any signing of anything though, still looking around at other dealers to see who does have a Hybrid, and see if I can take a long drive in it. If I have to do the same thing in that car, then adios, but if I determine that I can get decent MPG without the extreme P&G, then I will persue it further. It may not be something actually wrong with this car, just how its programmed, and it is possible there was a slight change on the line after it was built that Ford wont admit to.

 

I have dumped cars faster for lessor things than this, which shows I am trying to resolve it, but I can only go so far, I dont have the time to waste on it, already wasted 6 hours on it yesterday.

[terryb]

Damn shame. The driving method you described sure isn't like the EPA test.

[acdii]

Hopefully this works. I took some video of my drive to document what is needed to be done in order to get 40 MPG. I had an 18 wheeler on my ass, and it takes a lot of concentration, so it isnt as good as it could have been, but it still shows the technique. It was also on a hilly road.

 

https://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=506827049359434

[Fynack]

Acdii , it may be time to lawyer up

 

http://www.mpgfraud.com/

 

Ive already been contacted and will most likely pursue a case. This is ridiculous that 39-40 is considered acceptable on a 47mpg rated car but to also do it in a obviously deceiving manner is just wrong. These are the same lawyers that filed the suit in Cali and there is no fees if they dont win, otherwise they get 30%. Also most likely itll turn in to a class action in your state. Even if I lose the case I dont lose a dime but it sends a message to Ford to live up to the hype.

[Scott029]

My lifetime MPG is 31 in my '13 Fusion Hybrid with 2800 miles on it. My wife & I drove a Honda Civic Hybrid for 4 years &

know how to get good mileage. I do have Conti Extreme Winter tires on it and my wife only works 2.5 miles from our home

so I know she is getting terrible MPG on that round trip but......... except in city driving doing 25 to 50 mph I can't get better than

36-38 MPG out of it. Have taken 6 or 7, 300 mile round trips and can go two different ways.. One way is Interstate (70MPH), one

way is highway/city (60MPH on the highway and around 10 towns with 25-45MPH). Driving very conservatively for MPG we average

around 33 on the interstate route and around 36 on the highway route. No matter what I do or how gentle I am with the gas peddle

it won't vary those results more than 1-2 MPG's. In town with 25-50 MPH routes I can get over 40 MPG if I really try but once I

stop turtle driving it goes back to 35-37 MPG's. I was one of those that told people to break it in, it's winter blend fuel, it's cold

outside, you have to learn how to drive it etc. but now I do think this car has a problem. I'm sure Ford know that too!

[Fynack]

One thing about these forums is their anonymous and I would say half the people on them are Ford Marketing Employees. Am i being paranoid?? I dont think so. Ford monitors and writes on all forums and added entry to Fuelly and fueleconomy.gov, which are real which are not is going to be impossible to tell.

Edited February 14, 2013 by Fynack

[shaggy314]

I dunno. I think you'd be hard pressed to say my numbers aren't real and by association my Energi's will be real... well, once I GET mine. /sigh

Edited February 14, 2013 by shaggy314