Dead 12 Volt Battery - 2013 Fusion Hybrid

[murphy]

Because of the way the 12 volt battery is used it should be an AGM battery instead of a starter battery. I put one in my car although I had to take a hacksaw to the battery tray to make it fit.

[lolder]

I gather the charging system hasn't minded the different characteristics of the AGM. Keep us posted.

Edited October 17, 2014 by lolder

[murphy]

Charging has not been a problem. The charge level (SOC) still drops when the car sits in the garage for a week but the voltage doesn't drop anywhere near as much as it did with the starter battery. If it hasn't been driven for a week I hook up a battery charger and bring the charge level back up. The significant point about an AGM battery is it is not damaged by being at a low charge level. A starter battery will be damaged by material flaking off of the plates and collecting at the bottom of the case. When that debris reaches the bottom of the plates the cell shorts out and the battery must be replaced.

[lolder]

I just had a shorted cell in a 37 month old battery in my 2010 FFH. I had replaced the OEM battery as a precaution because of a persistent red ball about 28 months after the car was built and kept it as a den emergency power supply. I put that back in for a day until I got a new one from Ford and the still good old one is now back in the den. The one that lasted 37 months had gone dead once from leaving the car in accessory mode. Ford sold the new one to me for $44 + tax instead of $118 +.

[tr7driver]

When you hook a charger or tender to the battery, do you hook it to the jumping points under the hood or do you hook it directly to the battery?

[Easy Rider]

When you hook a charger or tender to the battery, do you hook it to the jumping points under the hood or do you hook it directly to the battery?

It makes absolutely no difference.

Do whichever is the most convenient in your situation.

[murphy]

When you hook a charger or tender to the battery, do you hook it to the jumping points under the hood or do you hook it directly to the battery?

The jump points under the hood.

[hybridbear]

Murphy - did you reprogram the BCM for the different battery type when you installed the new battery?

[murphy]

Murphy - did you reprogram the BCM for the different battery type when you installed the new battery?

No. There are no entries in the table that even come close to the parameters of the battery.

[hybridbear]

No. There are no entries in the table that even come close to the parameters of the battery.

Interesting. I wonder if the BCM then gets confused about charging since the battery you have installed behaves differently than what the car is expecting. How does the charging process differ in an AGM battery from a standard battery?

[Easy Rider]

The regulator function in newer cars is set to a point where it works just FINE with all common battery types under most conditions.

 

Those of you who seem to be obsessed with the "difference" in charging for AGM batteries should find something else to obsess over.

THIS subject is just a waste of your time.

[hybridbear]

No. There are no entries in the table that even come close to the parameters of the battery.

Here's what Larry found for options in the table:

Name: BATTERY_TYPE

Description: Battery Type

Available types: Mode with possible values:

- 4 - AGM 80Ah 700CCA T7 Case

- 5 - AGM 70Ah 600CCA H6 Case

- 6 - AGM 80Ah 700CCA H7 Case

- 7 - Varta 43Ah 390CCA T4 Case

- 8 - Varta 52Ah 500CCA T5 Case

- 9 - Varta 60Ah 590CCA T6 Case

- 10 - Varta 80Ah 700CCA17 Case

- 11 - Varta 90h 800CCAT8 Case

- 12 - Varta 60Ah 520CCA H5 Case

- 13 - Varta 70Ah 600CCA H6 Case

- 14 - Varta 80Ah 700CCA H7 Case

- 15 - Varta 90h 800CCA H8 Case

- 16 - Varta 90h 950CCA HB Case

- 17 - Exide 43Ah 390CCA T4 Case

- 18 - Exide 52Ah 500CCA T5 Case

- 19 - Exide 60Ah 590CCA T6 Case

- 20 - Exide 80Ah 700CCA T7 Case

- 21 - Exide 90Ah 800CCA TB Case

- 22 - Exide 60Ah 520CCA H5 Case

- 23 - Exide 70Ah 600CCA H6 Case

- 24 - Exide 80Ah 700CCA H7 Case

- 25 - Exide 90Ah 800CCA H8 Case

- 26 - Exide 90Ah 950CCA HB Case

 

I'd think that one of the AGM options would be closer to your new battery than the factory default.

[murphy]

Optima D31A

 

Performance Data:
Open Circuit Voltage (Fully charged): 13.1 volts
Internal Resistance (Fully charged): .0025 ohms
Capacity: 75 Ah (C/20)
Reserve Capacity: BCI: 155 minutes
(25 amp discharge, 80°F (26.7°C), to 10.5 volts cut-off)

Power:
CCA (BCI 0°F): 900 amps
MCA (BCI 32°F): 1125 amps

I'm not having any problems so I'll stick with "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

[GrySql]

The regulator function in newer cars is set to a point where it works just FINE with all common battery types under most conditions.

 

Those of you who seem to be obsessed with the "difference" in charging for AGM batteries should find something else to obsess over.

THIS subject is just a waste of your time.

As this FFH is somewhat different than a normal new car it has a different approach to charging the 12v battery and maintaining the low voltage system. It uses a DC/DC converter that sits on the HVB and is used to charge the 12v battery, see below. Ford provided a Table of accepted batteries that are listed in a post above that the DC/DC software is known to work with, but that is not all the batteries that will work in this system.

 

Direct Current/Direct Current (DC/DC) Converter Control Module - Overview

The Direct Current/Direct Current (DC/DC) converter control module is an air-cooled component that converts high-voltage (152-350 volts for HEV vehicles or 168-361 volts for PHEV vehicles) DC power from the high voltage battery to low-voltage (12 volts) DC power. This charges the 12-volt battery through the low-voltage battery cables and powers the low-voltage electrical system, eliminating the need for a conventional engine-driven alternator. It utilizes a dedicated control module which is part of the Direct Current/Direct Current (DC/DC) converter control module. The Direct Current/Direct Current (DC/DC) converter control module communicates with other modules over the HS-CAN. The Direct Current/Direct Current (DC/DC) converter control module is serviceable and located in the electronics compartment of the high voltage battery pack.

 

The DC/DC converter module

 

 

The 12v battery is also equipped with a Battery Monitoring Sensor (in Blue). The Battery Monitoring Sensor is clamped directly to the negative terminal of the battery and grounds to the vehicle at the chassis ground connection point through the negative battery cable and eyelet. It is part of the negative battery cable and cannot be serviced separately. The Battery Monitoring Sensor continuously monitors the condition and the state of charge of the 12V battery and provides the BCM with this information.

 

Battery Monitoring Sensor.

 

[lolder]

The 2010-12 DC/DC converter system appears to be quite different with a separate large water cooled unit in the engine compartment. The new one seems far simpler and cheaper.

[Dominick G Kasmauskas]

Yup...dead car in driveway this morning. Only sitting for 12 hours. Fun part is getting into trunk to jump start. Ford didn't think this one through. If i was elderly and on a limited budget....I'd be screwed.

[gkinla]

Actually Ford did think this through. Starting on page 219 and showing a picture on page 220 of my owners manual, shows the under hood jump starting connections.

Edited November 25, 2014 by gkinla

[hybridbear]

The 2010-12 DC/DC converter system appears to be quite different with a separate large water cooled unit in the engine compartment. The new one seems far simpler and cheaper.

The DCDC converter in the 2013+ is only cooled when the HVB fan is on. Without the HVB fan blowing it gets to 180+ F fairly quickly, even in winter. When the HVB fan is blowing it is only 20-30 warmer than the air blowing across the battery in my observations.

[Robmiller13]

I have had problems with my battery going dead when I don't driven the car for a few days. I have 24,000 mIles on my 2013 and have had it for 18 months. It has never stayed in accessory mode too long before battery saver comes on. Since last jump start, Sync and the blue tooth have not worked properly.

[Robmiller13]

Need to figure out how you get the car in neutral with a dead battery too.

Edited December 2, 2014 by Robmiller13

[murphy]

Need to figure out how you get the car in neutral with a dead battery too.

It's in the owners Manual.

 

Basically the right side console panel is removed and a long thin screwdriver is used to release the latch that keeps the shift lever in Park.

 

The panel is held in place by spring clips. A plastic tool designed for the purpose is handy to avoid causing damage when removing the panel.

[Easy Rider]

I have had problems with my battery going dead when I don't driven the car for a few days. I have 24,000 mIles on my 2013 and have had it for 18 months. It has never stayed in accessory mode too long before battery saver comes on. Since last jump start, Sync and the blue tooth have not worked properly.

It is fairly common for the 12 V battery to be "abused" on the dealers lot, causing them to fail abnormally soon.

 

Two things need to be done: Warranty claim on a new battery.

Charging voltage tested after the new battery is installed.

 

Make that 3 things: Get a low capacity tender type charger for future use.

At this moment, that is NOT a substitute for a new battery though.

A new battery needs to be fully charged with an external charger before or soon after installation and you can't trust the dealer to do that.

[gkinla]

I've had the LVB replaced twice under warranty, the first at 3,000 miles the second at 18,500 miles. Both times I took pictures of the

BS message with a cell phone and showed them to my SA, because it never repeats at the dealer. The first was supposidly due to a bad batch of batteries Ford recieved, the second was just a failure. You shouldn't be putting up with this, there is a problem and Ford has to step up to remedy your situation. The radio and accessories should stay on for at least 8 minutes with the key off before the system times out. Unless you open the door, then the system shuts off immediately.

Edited December 2, 2014 by gkinla

[terryb]

My '13 has just started delivering the message on startup and shutdown. Mileage is 19200. There was a previous occurrence for a few days and then it cleared up. It seems there is a different chime sounding too. I'm gonna contact my SA first thing Monday. It seems that the message showed up since I had temperate weather not needing anything except radio.

Edited December 7, 2014 by terryb

[FordService]

My '13 has just started delivering the message on startup and shutdown. Mileage is 19200. There was a previous occurrence for a few days and then it cleared up. It seems there is a different chime sounding too. I'm gonna contact my SA first thing Monday. It seems that the message showed up since I had temperate weather not needing anything except radio.

 

Hi terryb,

 

Were you able to get into contact with your Service Adviser? Send me an update on how your Fusion's doing & any progress made. :)

 

Meagan