Ford quality (?) - buying new hybrid

[jeff_h]

Here is my feedback after just owning a Prius for 128,000 miles.

 

I used to browse and participate in the forums on priuschat and priusonline too, and there are some MPG fanatics like like there are here, to each his own, as some are more honed in on the sound system or other parts of the vehicle.

 

I was in the same boat a few months ago, wondering if I should get another Prius or switch to the FFH. I am very glad I chose the FFH as the MPG hit is not that bad (I am now averaging 41 where I got 51 in the Prius), the sound system is FAR better in the FFH (although I am no audio aficionado as others that you will read posts from, more power to them I just like the sound much better), and the ride is also FAR better in the FFH (don't just compare rides in the front seat, compare rides in the back seat and feel for yourself).

 

Also, I really was not concerned with the reliability of Ford with a hybrid system, my wife has had an Escape hybrid for almost 4 years now and the only thing that has ever gone wrong was some venting fan for the hybrid battery that was fixed in an hour. The only recall I can remember was a wiring harness that had to be replaced, another job was done in under an hour while I waited.

 

My Prius was recalled for a steering shaft knuckle replacement, a job that took 3 hours but also nothing huge. I was also driving down the road at 33,000 miles and all of my warning lights went off, I got to the dealer and found that an electric water pump died which I thought was odd at 33,000 miles. Then at 75,000 miles I went to get my engine belt replaced and they found a leaking axle seal, which I guess is a minor thing that can happen to any car. So to that end, and looking at any reliability data, these brands are equal and both quality vehicles. Many people still have the "Japanese is better" paradigm, which I don't think is true based on data that I've seen and certainly not true based on my own experience. But everyone I guess will have an opinion whether it's based on real data or anecdotal evidence, that's something that will never change when it comes to one brand or another as there are a couple brands that I would absolutely never own (because I've driven them as new rental cars for a few thousand miles and have some experience with them and would not pay $1,000 for any of them), but that's just me.

 

So again, with Ford having plenty of data and lessons learned from making thousands of FEHs, I believe they've put into the design and production of the FFH and I have no worries there.

 

Good luck!

 

Bumping this one back up -- today is the 1-year anniversary for my FFH: 38,400 miles, zero issues.

[Zack]

jeff_h thanks for post. We have our FFH for 7 months now and still love it. It was right decision. In the meantime a lot of things happened, like Toyota sticky pedals, recalls, even Lexus recalls, JD Powers best quality for FFH and more...

On bad note can't regret enough for not taking NAV. It was 2000 bucks more. Paid 37.4k for car.

[chubbnig]

Hi everybody,

 

New member, just registered and coming up with big dilemma. It is old question Prius of FFH?

Here are the facts I learned from both FFH and Prius forums (condensed version):

 

* Prius 2010 has best MPG (50 or something like that)

* FFH is MPG second, before Camry hybrid

* FFH has coolest cabin

* Prius and Camry have highest reliability marks, specially Prius has highest owner satisfaction best reliability of all cars (see Consumers Magazine) sold in US

* FFH costs more than Prius, similar to Camry but fully loaded is somewhat less (depending what you take)

 

Hanging around http://priuschat.com I learned that it is almost freakland over there. Most of the people posting are so obsessed with their MPG and Priuses that they have transformed into chameleons. One eye looking forward and second on on MFD to watch MPG numbers. Statements like: " ...I ruined my perfect MPG today... had to drive uphill so it dropped to 45 from 55...). I mean it is getting ridiculous. Common sense is thrown out of the window. What I want to say is that you can get true picture and answers from Prius crowd so that info about super reliability, no repairs and so on maybe not 100% true.

 

Going back to FFH I am all for it.

 

* I like the style - it is best looking American made car at this moment, simply gorgeous

* Like performance - true hybrid specs, MPG and all that

* American made - released at perfect time in history, we should all buy (at least) one and help Ford, economy and in turn ourselves

* Cabin - very nice one, much nicer than Prius/Camry

* Gadgets, add-ons - nice selection, would prefer XM over Sirius but that is not a deal breaker

* Colors - white is fine but will be missing tan leather/interior

* Price - have to visit Canadian showroom to see where are we at (it is usually more than in USA)

 

So all conclusions are "go" except last one. Here is my biggest doubt. Toyota cars ARE very good. It's a fact. Where we really stand at for Fusion Hybrid reliability? It is sure too early to say since car is not out long enough, but looking overall to Ford cars reliability? So far doesn't sound encouraging. I mean you pay more for hybrid, save money on gas, buy American but if there is one or more major repairs down the road combined with low resale value that plagues all American made cars that would negate all the money savings, right?

 

I would really appreciate honest opinions on this.

 

Regards,

Zack

 

Having gone through this process myself I would suggest that it all depends on your use for the car. If you intend to potter around town, going to work and shopping, then the somewhat smaller Prius would be fine. The Prius currently has the best mpg, but its performance is sluggish compared with the FFH. Originally I thought that the Prius would be a good car, until I rented one and drove from Ottawa to Toronto and back. It was an uncomfortable trip with some difficult highway moments in passing fast trucks. And I also found that vision out of the back window was a bit obscured. The FFH has been in production for several years and judging by the forums, is rated quite highly in reliability. Ford used to have a very tarnished reputation, but in recent years it has made enormous progress and their products are highly rated throughout the world. I ordered a fully loaded FFH on April 12th and it is expected to arrive in Ottawa on July 16th.

 

Regards

 

Nigel

[Herdmaster73]

These are interesting points from everyone but here is my two cents worth.

 

Took delivery of my FHH the first week of February when th weather in upsattae South Carolina was still cold, lows in the 20's and high's in low 40's. Just turned over 5800 miles and the long term MPG says I am averaging 40.9 miles per gallon. Most of my driving so far is back and forth the work, about 35 mile round trip with a 50/50 mixtiure of interstate and city driving and I have not really found anything to complain about. On days when we go out to each, all my co-workers want me to drive becasue they say they love riding in the car becasue of the drive and sound system. My booss loves the navagtion screen and the ease of reading the map.

 

Took a trip to West Virgian about 6 weeks ago with three adults and a fuly loaded car and averaged 40.5 MPG round trip. The FFH drove and rode so well that I was still felt like I could drive another 100 miles after going the 430 miles. The car rode so well that even my wife, who was very against me purchasing the car, did not complain and even bragged about the car when wearrived in WV.

 

Yesterday my mother and I took a trip from upsate South carolina up into the moutains to the Blue Ridge Parkway, along the parkway for 60 miles and back to South Carolina and avergaed 45.8 MPG.

 

The only recall item I have recieved from Ford is to bring the car in so they can check the blbots in the driver seat to make sure the correct ones are installed. I guess you can say Ford has come a long way with their quality and if they continue they will be the one that the other car companies will be mesuring against and trying to beat.

 

 

[savngas]

We just purchased a FFH last week after much research and many test drives. Car and Driver was responsible for me even considering the FFH. We own a 03 Prius, a 05 4Runner and a 1986 Saab 900S. I drove the Camry Hybrid once and removed it from our list. The Prius was a candidate, but is not a car I would do a road trip in. We did it once in our Prius and were sore and stiff for days. The Prius is a commuter and if I were getting rid of my Prius, I would buy the new Prius. The FFH on the other hand handles well, is comfortable and I don't feel like I am a sardine. There are small finish issues that I will make Ford aware of, like the power receptacle in the console that has a cheap rubber plug with a lanyard on it. Put a flip top cover on it like the 4Runner has. A small thing really. The overall quality of the car is outstanding, and that is why I even noticed that cheesy little cover. :shift:

 

My 2010 FFH, purchased In June 2010 has a flip up cover on the120VAC outlet...

I am very impresed with quality of this vehicle so far @ 5000 miles, firm and quiet ride.

B)

[mirak]

I also spent a lot of time on priuschat last year when I was getting ready to buy a new car. I was all excited about the 2010 "3rd Gen" Prius - until I actually test drove one. The interior felt cheap, the ride was rough, turning lousy, and the instrument display was very small and blah. That's when I decided to check out the Fusion. The Fusion blew the Prius out of the water in most categories (including price, back when the tax credit was in effect).

 

In sum, the Prius gets better gas milage, has a hatchback for more rear storage, and has push-button start and keyless entry. Those were about the only discernable advantages. The Fusion won in just about every other category. I have some detailed posts, including comaprison charts, over on the priuschat website under the same username "mirak". Some of the Prius-philes were not too pleased with my opinion that the Fusion was the better hybrid. As it truns out, most of the professional reviewers, including Motortrend, have sided with me.

 

I have now owned my Fusion about 11 months and driven about 13,000 miles. Overall quality has been superb. My lifetime average mpg is currently 39.8, and I actually get 50+ on most days during warm weather.

 

I only have two complaints:

(1) Sync just isn't quite "there" yet. Still some kinks to work out in the interface. Shouldn't have to say a "phone" prompt before the "call" prompt. I should be able to just say "call"!

(2) There's a squeeky fan bearing somewhere in the HVAC. On cold days when the heat is on, but only at low speeds, you can hear a very slight "chirping" from the fan which sounds exactly like a cricket! Haven't had time to replicate it for a mechanic yet, but I know it's a fan bearing - easily fixed.

[akirby]

(1) Sync just isn't quite "there" yet. Still some kinks to work out in the interface. Shouldn't have to say a "phone" prompt before the "call" prompt. I should be able to just say "call"!

(2) There's a squeeky fan bearing somewhere in the HVAC. On cold days when the heat is on, but only at low speeds, you can hear a very slight "chirping" from the fan which sounds exactly like a cricket! Haven't had time to replicate it for a mechanic yet, but I know it's a fan bearing - easily fixed.

 

That was due to the fact that navigation and sync were separate units so you had to say Phone to let the nav unit know to pass control to Sync.

 

That should no longer be the case once Fusion gets MyFordTouch which is all integrated.

[mirak]

That was due to the fact that navigation and sync were separate units so you had to say Phone to let the nav unit know to pass control to Sync.

 

That should no longer be the case once Fusion gets MyFordTouch which is all integrated.

 

Well, I guess that's good for purchasers of the 2011 FFH, but it doesn't really help me unless MyFordTouch is just a software upgrade. Looks like a whole new interface to me. Or am I wrong?

 

I've never really understood the "seperate units" explanation. Why can't Sync simply be the top layer? Seems like a real design flaw, but also a flaw that should be able to be fixed with a software upgrade. What, exactly, is the impediment?

 

It's not that big of a deal, but that's also what makes it so annoying: this shouldn't be that big of a deal to fix!

[akirby]

Well, I guess that's good for purchasers of the 2011 FFH, but it doesn't really help me unless MyFordTouch is just a software upgrade. Looks like a whole new interface to me. Or am I wrong?

 

I've never really understood the "seperate units" explanation. Why can't Sync simply be the top layer? Seems like a real design flaw, but also a flaw that should be able to be fixed with a software upgrade. What, exactly, is the impediment?

 

It's not that big of a deal, but that's also what makes it so annoying: this shouldn't be that big of a deal to fix!

 

Ford has had voice controlled radio/nav for years. My 03 Aviator had it. I don't know the engineering details but being a former software developer I can see where it would be easier to do it that way. As far as fixing it - they did fix it, with myfordtouch. I suspect it required hardware changes which is why it couldn't be done with a software upgrade.

[DeadButDreaming]

Here is my feedback after just owning a Prius for 128,000 miles.

 

 

 

I used to browse and participate in the forums on priuschat and priusonline too, and there are some MPG fanatics like like there are here, to each his own, as some are more honed in on the sound system or other parts of the vehicle.

 

I was in the same boat a few months ago, wondering if I should get another Prius or switch to the FFH. I am very glad I chose the FFH as the MPG hit is not that bad (I am now averaging 41 where I got 51 in the Prius), the sound system is FAR better in the FFH (although I am no audio aficionado as others that you will read posts from, more power to them I just like the sound much better), and the ride is also FAR better in the FFH (don't just compare rides in the front seat, compare rides in the back seat and feel for yourself).

 

Also, I really was not concerned with the reliability of Ford with a hybrid system, my wife has had an Escape hybrid for almost 4 years now and the only thing that has ever gone wrong was some venting fan for the hybrid battery that was fixed in an hour. The only recall I can remember was a wiring harness that had to be replaced, another job was done in under an hour while I waited.

 

My Prius was recalled for a steering shaft knuckle replacement, a job that took 3 hours but also nothing huge. I was also driving down the road at 33,000 miles and all of my warning lights went off, I got to the dealer and found that an electric water pump died which I thought was odd at 33,000 miles. Then at 75,000 miles I went to get my engine belt replaced and they found a leaking axle seal, which I guess is a minor thing that can happen to any car. So to that end, and looking at any reliability data, these brands are equal and both quality vehicles. Many people still have the "Japanese is better" paradigm, which I don't think is true based on data that I've seen and certainly not true based on my own experience. But everyone I guess will have an opinion whether it's based on real data or anecdotal evidence, that's something that will never change when it comes to one brand or another as there are a couple brands that I would absolutely never own (because I've driven them as new rental cars for a few thousand miles and have some experience with them and would not pay $1,000 for any of them), but that's just me.

 

So again, with Ford having plenty of data and lessons learned from making thousands of FEHs, I believe they've put into the design and production of the FFH and I have no worries there.

 

Good luck!

 

the sound system you hade in your prius was a JBL or the 6 speakers??