If you could get an Energi Titanium for nothing, would you take it?

[hybridbear]

I would. And that's exactly the situation we found ourselves in this week. Let me explain...

The recent purchases reported online of leftover 2013 FFHs & FFEs along with 2013 C-Maxes made me curious as to how many 2013s are left new on dealer lots across the country. So I spent a few minutes searching on cars.com and saw that there are still quite a few around. I noticed that a lot of the leftover vehicles seem to be rather basic models, without a lot of the advanced driver assistance technologies. And quite a few of the Fusions have MFT & Nav without many other options. Then I happened upon a loaded Energi Titanium with all the advanced driver assistance options just like we had on the white FFH.

Out of curiosity I e-mailed the dealer to see how low they'd be willing to sell it. The prices on cars.com basically all showed just MSRP or only a very small discount. The dealer e-mailed me back and indicated that they were willing to knock about $15k off MSRP (about 33%).

I then wrote back to see what they'd give us in trade for our FFH. I decided before I wrote them that the only way we'd do anything is if they were willing to give us $1500 above KBB for the trade. I decided upon this price because it would allow us to get the Energi for free, the tax credit basically equals the difference. Their initial response was right at KBB trade-in value.

Before I continue, I want to give you a little background on the dealer. They're a dealer in a small town in Wisconsin, about 4 hrs from Minneapolis. They're not near any big cities. They sell four brands at the one dealer building: Ford, Lincoln, Hyundai & Volkswagen. I had learned at a MNPEVOC (Minnesota Plug-in Vehicles Owners Circle) meeting that you can often find the best deals on plug-ins and battery electrics at small town dealers in the country that get sent a car that they don't know how to sell. A number of the Focus Electric owners in the group got their cars from dealers in rural MN or WI, same story for a few Energi owners in the group. Some of the Nissan Leaf owners also said that they found the best deals by getting a Leaf from a rural dealer rather than from one in the Twin Cities. A Mitsubishi iMiev owner did the same thing. Considering that this dealer has 70 trucks out of 100 new Fords on their lot I figured that they fit the same profile.

On Tuesday I told the salesman that they'd have to do better on the trade difference to make it work. He spoke to the used car manager (also the finance manager who did our paperwork today, very small dealer) and offered another $1000 for the white FFH. I asked if I could discuss it with my wife and call him back Wednesday. After we agreed Tuesday night that we'd do it only of they'd give us another $500, I called the salesman and told him that on Wednesday morning. He said he'd ask and e-mail me. Less than 5 minutes later he e-mailed me and said they'd do it.

Today we drove about 4 hours (220 miles) each way to Wisconsin and picked up the Energi Titanium. After the tax credit we will have paid less than $500 for the new Energi Titanium. And about $30 in gas total to drive 440 miles today.

It was really incredible!! And I encourage anyone who's looking for a new FFH to consider one of the leftover 2013s because you can probably find a dealer who's desperate to get the car off their lot.

Edited September 7, 2014 by hybridbear

[murphy]

Keep an eye on the 12 volt battery. It's been sitting around long enough that the 12 volt battery has probably gone dead a few times. Many (most) lead acid batteries are permanently damaged when they are allowed to die completely.

[GrySql]

Fantastic story and congratulations!

I like how you replace the car before they need tires! ;)

 

Do you get another Ford CS check because this one is a 2013?

[hybridbear]

Fantastic story and congratulations!

I like how you replace the car before they need tires! ;)

 

Do you get another Ford CS check because this one is a 2013?

Haha, who needs tires?!? But my wife says no more changing cars and I agree. I don't want to change cars anymore, just keep this one till it runs into the ground.

 

No check, it has the new window sticker.

 

Keep an eye on the 12 volt battery. It's been sitting around long enough that the 12 volt battery has probably gone dead a few times. Many (most) lead acid batteries are permanently damaged when they are allowed to die completely.

I will. The 12V SOC was around 70% while we were driving home. I'm hoping that with time the car will charge it from the wall and get it full. I asked the dealer to test it before we picked up the car and they said it passed the load test.

Edited September 7, 2014 by hybridbear

[md13ffhguy]

Good for you HB! Unfortunately for me, I tried the calling around for new 13s last week. I found 2 that interested me, but to my amazement, the dealers weren't discounting them all that much - and neither expressed any willingness to budge. In fact, the initial price quote I got on the 14 included a larger discount, and then I was able negotiate more than expected on my trade as well.

 

I hope you enjoy the Energi and I'm looking forward to hearing about your experiences with it.

Edited September 7, 2014 by md13ffhguy

[hybridbear]

Good for you HB! Unfortunately for me, I tried the calling around for new 13s last week. I found 2 that interested me, but to my amazement, the dealers weren't discounting them all that much - and neither expressed any willingness to budge. In fact, the initial price quote I got on the 14 included a larger discount, and then I was able negotiate more than expected on my trade as well.

I hope you enjoy the Energi and I'm looking forward to hearing about your experiences with it.

Wow! I'm surprised. I asked the used car manager/finance manager about how it works when you have an old car like that. He said that once it gets past the point where Ford is offering incentives then Ford gives the dealer a chunk of cash and says "good luck". He said that they got $8000 from Ford for the Energi. Then they sold it another almost $7000 below MSRP. Invoice price is about $2500 less than MSRP. Someone previously said holdback is 3% on the Fusion which would give them another $1350, or so, in margin. But overall they sold the car about as cheap as they possibly could have.

 

I'm not sure how much dealers would have received for a leftover 2013 Fusion Hybrid, but I imagine it was at least a few thousand.

[corncobs]

Not bad not bad at all very cool story congrats on another new FFH oh I'm sorry FFE ;)

[darrelld]

I would. And that's exactly the situation we found ourselves in this week. Let me explain...

 

The recent purchases reported online of leftover 2013 FFHs & FFEs along with 2013 C-Maxes made me curious as to how many 2013s are left new on dealer lots across the country. So I spent a few minutes searching on cars.com and saw that there are still quite a few around. I noticed that a lot of the leftover vehicles seem to be rather basic models, without a lot of the advanced driver assistance technologies. And quite a few of the Fusions have MFT & Nav without many other options. Then I happened upon a loaded Energi Titanium with all the advanced driver assistance options just like we had on the white FFH.

 

Out of curiosity I e-mailed the dealer to see how low they'd be willing to sell it. The prices on cars.com basically all showed just MSRP or only a very small discount. The dealer e-mailed me back and indicated that they were willing to knock about $15k off MSRP (about 33%).

 

I then wrote back to see what they'd give us in trade for our FFH. I decided before I wrote them that the only way we'd do anything is if they were willing to give us $1500 above KBB for the trade. I decided upon this price because it would allow us to get the Energi for free, the tax credit basically equals the difference. Their initial response was right at KBB trade-in value.

 

Before I continue, I want to give you a little background on the dealer. They're a dealer in a small town in Wisconsin, about 4 hrs from Minneapolis. They're not near any big cities. They sell four brands at the one dealer building: Ford, Lincoln, Hyundai & Volkswagen. I had learned at a MNPEVOC (Minnesota Plug-in Vehicles Owners Circle) meeting that you can often find the best deals on plug-ins and battery electrics at small town dealers in the country that get sent a car that they don't know how to sell. A number of the Focus Electric owners in the group got their cars from dealers in rural MN or WI, same story for a few Energi owners in the group. Some of the Nissan Leaf owners also said that they found the best deals by getting a Leaf from a rural dealer rather than from one in the Twin Cities. A Mitsubishi iMiev owner did the same thing. Considering that this dealer has 70 trucks out of 100 new Fords on their lot I figured that they fit the same profile.

 

On Tuesday I told the salesman that they'd have to do better on the trade difference to make it work. He spoke to the used car manager (also the finance manager who did our paperwork today, very small dealer) and offered another $1000 for the white FFH. I asked if I could discuss it with my wife and call him back Wednesday. After we agreed Tuesday night that we'd do it only of they'd give us another $500, I called the salesman and told him that on Wednesday morning. He said he'd ask and e-mail me. Less than 5 minutes later he e-mailed me and said they'd do it.

 

Today we drove about 4 hours (220 miles) each way to Wisconsin and picked up the Energi Titanium. After the tax credit we will have paid less than $500 for the new Energi Titanium. And about $30 in gas total to drive 440 miles today.

 

It was really incredible!! And I encourage anyone who's looking for a new FFH to consider one of the leftover 2013s because you can probably find a dealer who's desperate to get the car off their lot.

 

 

 

Congratulations on your new FFE, very good find.

 

I noticed the same results back in June when searching for my Hybrid Titanium. Plenty of SE's to choose from but I wanted the Pre-Collision option which requires Radar Cruise and those were hard to find. Drivers in my area have a habit of not turning their headlights on shortly after the sun goes down and the Radar Cruise can sniff them out even in the dark.

Edited September 7, 2014 by darrelld

[GrySql]

I encourage anyone who's looking for a new FFH to consider one of the leftover 2013s because you can probably find a dealer who's desperate to get the car off their lot.

Out of curiosity I followed your example and looked for a leftover 2013 Energi out west here.

I used Cars.com with a 500 mile radius from me in So Cal.

There were surprisingly few available, mostly base models and none equipped like yours.

As I looked at the Dealer websites each car was still listed with the window sticker price but there was no point in calling, I wouldn't want a base model anyway.

 

Those Energi's must sell well out here, I know my Dealer had 25 of them on the lot on one occasion when I was there.

They have nine 2015 Fusion Energi's for sale right now, zero 2014/2013.

 

The 2014 C-Max is another story, my Dealer has 34 Hybrid/Energi's leftover, but only one 2013.

[hybridbear]

Out of curiosity I followed your example and looked for a leftover 2013 Energi out west here.

I used Cars.com with a 500 mile radius from me in So Cal.

There were surprisingly few available, mostly base models and none equipped like yours.

As I looked at the Dealer websites each car was still listed with the window sticker price but there was no point in calling, I wouldn't want a base model anyway.

That's what I observed. The one we got was the only one that was really loaded. There were two others that I believe were pretty loaded, one in Alaska and one in Hawaii lol

[acdii]

Dude, you are worse than I am! LOL However, nice find! I might have done the same thing, but I like the car I have now and have no thoughts whatsoever of getting rid of it, I just want to get some new tires, maybe rims, but there is not one thing I wish this car had that I can get new(except maybe the 10 way passenger seat). Gonna start calling you THbear now.

[tr7driver]

What version of maps do you have?

[Da0ne]

nice pick up HB i was discussing this with my wife this weekend about trading in mine for a fully loaded FFE i will try to do the same as you and hopefully i can come back with similar success as you

[SteveB_TX]

First, to answer your question... NO, I would NOT take it. There are ZERO EV (read Energi) certified dealerships anywhere near me for service. :detective: I'm not even certain the one each Ford and Lincoln dealerships are qualified to work on the FFH and MKZh.

 

 

Secondly, congrats on your find. :)

 

 

[hybridbear]

What version of maps do you have?

The new Energi doesn't have navigation.

[jeff_h]

nice pick up HB i was discussing this with my wife this weekend about trading in mine for a fully loaded FFE i will try to do the same as you and hopefully i can come back with similar success as you

 

Dude just cut your deal with a dealer here in the DC area (there are plenty of 2014s around here, maybe even some 2013s) and I'll meet you at the airport and take you to the dealer -- if you can deal with the smaller trunk space and can get a good deal on one, I think the $4k tax credit may tip the scales for you as it certainly was an incentive for me.

[Da0ne]

 

Dude just cut your deal with a dealer here in the DC area (there are plenty of 2014s around here, maybe even some 2013s) and I'll meet you at the airport and take you to the dealer -- if you can deal with the smaller trunk space and can get a good deal on one, I think the $4k tax credit may tip the scales for you as it certainly was an incentive for me.

 

thanks i might take you up on that offer

[storksb]

Jeff_H, I searched Saturday and found a handful of 2013 FFE's in the DC area, there was a nicely equipped one for just over 26K at one dealer with NAV and the luxury pack, would be tempted but wouldn't be able to get my road bike in the trunk so will stick with the FFH. If I had know I may have been able to convince my wife to get one before she bought her TDi Jetta last month.

[47Minutes]

I applied a little of this logic when my 2013 FFE was declared a total loss from a 7/9/14 accident.

 

I got the wife to agree to buying a comparable used 2013 FFE. I did some research and the best I found was one in OH for around $29K. Then I looked at 2014 FFEs and found a well priced one with the options I really wanted in MD. After the federal tax incentive and a new grant launched in TX (of all places) it puts the vehicle cost in line with the used one. Add in the 0% financing I got on a new vehicle compared to maybe 5% on a used, it will cost less in the end.

 

So I bought my 2014 last week. Now I'm waiting on transport to bring it to me. I really didn't want the first 1300 miles on it to be a road trip back home. So I'm ponying up some $$ to get it here.

[hybridbear]

Keep an eye on the 12 volt battery. It's been sitting around long enough that the 12 volt battery has probably gone dead a few times. Many (most) lead acid batteries are permanently damaged when they are allowed to die completely.

So far so good. It's now showing an SOC above 90. In contrast, the hybrid was almost always in the 50s or 40s for SOC, sometimes 60s. The Energi has an additional PID which allows me to see how many amps are going from the DCDC converter to charge the 12V. When the 12V SOC is below 85% the car has been sending 6-7 amps to charge it. Once the SOC gets near 90 it drops to under 1 amp.

[tr7driver]

I'm looking at applying the same logic to a 13 c-max. Any advice on what to look for, recommended options?

[hybridbear]

I'm looking at applying the same logic to a 13 c-max. Any advice on what to look for, recommended options?

My parents love the power liftgate on their C-Max. I wish we had it on the Focus Electric.

[tr7driver]

I guess I should clarify that I'm not looking to trade the Fusion for a C-Max but considering replacing my old truck with one. So far the best deal I've found on a 13 is $5K under invoice, so I'm having second thoughts.

[SaveSomeGreen]

I'm looking at applying the same logic to a 13 c-max. Any advice on what to look for, recommended options?

Check out Bloomington Ford in Bloomington, IN. They have a loaded 2013 C-max Energi that I almost bought. It has the best package and every option. I had them down to $29,500, but wanted a couple thousand more and they wouldn't budge. Plus, my wife didn't like it that much (she has a '13 Fusion Hybrid that she truly loves and did not want to trade, even though she would use almost no gas on her 22-mile daily commute if we had bought the C-max.)

 

Anyway, 2 weeks after we left the dealership, they called and offered to sell it to us for $27,500, but she said she flat out didn't want it!

So, after the tax credit, you'd be looking at about $23,500 for a loaded, brand new C-max Energi!

Edited September 17, 2014 by SaveSomeGreen

[tr7driver]

The White one? I looked at it on the internet. Is it as nice in person as it looks on the web?