Transmission Problems

[11MKZ]

Hi all first post and hopefully someone has some insight. 2011 MKZ Hybrid started to act horribly while trying to go to WV. Whenever we(my Girlfriend and I) would try to go up a hill the car felt like it would shift into neutral and the Pull over safety light illuminated and lost power. Did the vehicle check and it showed a issue with the hybrid system. Turned around(after it acted up several times) to go to the shop I work at scanned the vehicle and showed 2 fault codes.

 

P1A14 - Hybrid Powertrain Control Module - Transmission Disabled.

P0A3E - Generator Inverter Over Temperature.

 

Looking up the codes on ALLDATA both show to replace the transmission as the first step and then to check to see if the engine is seized. I haven't done any diagnostic, haven't checked transmission fluid, and while driving it acts perfectly fine until the light appears and you can feel the transmission bump out of drive.

 

With it being a holiday I wont be doing anything with it for now and luckily I have a spare car for my girlfriend to drive while it gets looked at. We purchased it a few months ago from carmax with an extended warranty and just rolled over 21k while driving back home so there is a chance it will be taken care of. I was wondering if anyone has had a similar issue or codes? Tried to look up similar issues on google, nothing came up and I apologize if this has been discussed before.

Edited July 4, 2014 by 11MKZ

[lolder]

This sounds like an electronic system cooling problem. The engine is obviously not seized and the transmission is probably OK. There is a separate pump and cooling system for the hybrid electrical components. Check the fluid level in the reservoir for that system. Only the recommended coolant should be added. Maybe you have a leak. The system is sensing an over-temperature and shutting off as a protection. Take it to Ford and it should be under warranty.

Edited July 5, 2014 by lolder

[Ryan Goodlett]

I am not a technician, but this comes from Oasis. I believe that the All Data representation of the codes are misleading. As you can see below, it appears the P0A3E is the initial code causing symptoms for your transmission. The P1A14 just tells you that your transmission is disabled. Sounds like there is an issue on your vehicle and I would take it in for service.

 

P1A14

Hybrid Powertrain Control Module - Transmission Disabled Description

This is an informational DTC and is set as the result of limited operating strategy (LOS) or failure mode effects management (FMEM) operating strategy that maintains limited vehicle function in the event of the powertrain control module (PCM), transaxle control module (TCM), traction battery control module (TBCM), or component concern.

Possible Causes

Powertrain or hybrid-electric system.

Diagnostic Aids

The circuit DTCs can be accompanied by the informational DTCs, and should be diagnosed first. An informational DTC without a circuit DTC may or may not indicate the actual concern and should be diagnosed as a symptom. Refer to the Workshop Manual Section 307-01B, Automatic Transmission/Transaxle.

Action Refer to the Description, Possible Causes and Diagnostic Aids for the DTC.

 

 

P0A3E Generator Inverter Over-Temperature Description

Indicates the generator motor inverter all three temperature sensors experienced an over temperature condition.

Possible Causes

• Motor electronics cooling system concerns
• The vehicle was driven beyond its design specifications
• Damaged transaxle

Action

GO to Pinpoint Test TL

Attached is the is the flowchart for diagnostics for P0A3E. Not something you can do from home. You have to have Fords IDS (diagnostics computer)

P0A3E Flowchart.pdf

[11MKZ]

Thanks for the replies. Went into the shop tonight, the reservoir was slightly low topped off with Ford dark green (Vehicle was in a front end collision 3 weeks after I purchased it, Dealer did a bad job fixing it and I have been fixing their mistakes as I find them). There is not a single drop of coolant under the vehicle or on the protective shield when I took it off. It doesn't look like I can pressure test the MECS side, does anyone know if I pressure test the coolant reservoir for the engine if it will pressure test both?

 

I touched the MECS pump and it was vibrating as it should and the coolant could be seen flowing in the reservoir. When doing a vehicle self check there are no issues everything checks ok. When scanning for codes there are codes in the memory (the two already posted). When doing a self test with the Snap-On Modis Scanner there are no codes that pop up. According to the flowchart if the codes don't pop up in a self test I'm supposed to go through a symptom based diagnostic which I will do further tomorrow as well as try to get the freeze frame data. I am at the moment thinking the MECS pump is intermittently going out, which seems to be a common Ford issue(not saying for everyone but pops up often) from all their previous hybrids

[lolder]

What is Ford green? The coolant fluids are almost clear in color and the recommended coolant is Motorcraft Premium Gold. Being in an accident puts a whole different light on the issue. The coolant systems are completely separate. I think the MECS pump probably has monitoring for malfunction but who knows what was screwed up by the accident. Has the 8 year 100 K miles hybrid warranty been voided by the accident? It shouldn't if Ford did the repair. Having a front end accident with these cars is like dropping your laptop in a lake. Good luck.

[11MKZ]

Agreed with the accident issue, we got it back on May 1st and haven't had an issue until now. The hybrid system showed all OK immediately after the accident radiator was replaced along with entire front bumper fogs lights, headlights, ect. On my 2011 MKZ Ford Dark Green Antifreeze is the specified coolant. I doubt the warranty has been voided that would be absolutely ridiculous I think. Was trying to diagnose and fix myself but if I can't figure it out by tuesday may take it to the dealer and have the extended warranty from Carmax pay for it or at least have them diagnose it for me. The MECS pump does not have a malfunction monitor on it simply a plug for power. On the FEHs the MECS pump is common and it too has no MIL code for just the pump simply puts the car into safe mode from what I have researched.

 

Woman turned in front of me and must not have seen me. Hit her left rear wheel and bent that in at a 45* angle. Caused just under 15K in damage thankfully on her insurance.

Edited July 7, 2014 by 11MKZ

[lolder]

I have heard of some of the Escape MECS pump problems but not in the 2nd Gen cars. That crash probably did in the DC/DC converter that is in that area also and that is in the MECS. I don't think you're finished with the repair problems. Just low level in the reservoir probably wouldn't cause the overheat unless it was empty. There were some air bubble problems in the ICE cooling system early on that caused some problems but that's a separate system. The pump may still have monitoring through it's power supply wires as the current can diagnose pump problems and there may be a message center warning. I don't know. They monitor almost everything and that pump is pretty important.

in 2010, somebody got hit by a truck on the other side of the front of a FFH in the Florida Panhandle. His 911 didn't work because the top of the 12 vdc battery was sheared off. Lot's of other drivers called it in and he got a broken finger from the airbag. A government accelerated testing program was monitoring two 2010 FFHs in courier service in the Phoenix basin for 160,000 miles. One of them was totaled at 80K. I asked the director of the program if they were able to get a mid-life assessment of that HVB. He said no, it was hit in the rear by a truck which destroyed the HVB. The surviving FFH HVB only deteriorated about 4-8% at the end of the 160K--- among the best ever tested.

[hybridbear]

Agreed with the accident issue, we got it back on May 1st and haven't had an issue until now. The hybrid system showed all OK immediately after the accident radiator was replaced along with entire front bumper fogs lights, headlights, ect. On my 2011 MKZ Ford Dark Green Antifreeze is the specified coolant. I doubt the warranty has been voided that would be absolutely ridiculous I think. Was trying to diagnose and fix myself but if I can't figure it out by tuesday may take it to the dealer and have the extended warranty from Carmax pay for it or at least have them diagnose it for me.

Since this is part of the hybrid system it's covered under the 8 yrs/100k warranty (10/150 in CARB states). This should be completely separate from any warranty you got from CarMax.

[11MKZ]

Update - Took the MKZ to a Ford dealership told them the issue and about the accident. Got a call the day after (tuesday) and said they wanted their transmission guy to look at it. He then determined that the coolant hose from the transmission to the cooler was collapsed from the routing the body shop did. Seems it isn't completely collapsed if I can drive around town but once the system is under a larger load it can't flow enough to keep cool. Paid the the diag fee and took it to the Lincoln dealer down the street where the work was done. Explained the situation and rather than ask why I chose to take it to Ford first, the service writer literally called me an idiot for taking it to the Ford dealer not a Lincoln dealer. Which obviously pissed me off pretty good and I told him I didn't trust the techs there after the terrible job on the repair work they did to which he said it wasn't his department so he didn't care. Will definitely be the last time I take it there unless its more issues related to their work. And I will be talking to a manager once I pick up my MKZ. That was this afternoon(thursday) so I'm hoping they agree on Fords diagnostic fix it reimburse me so I can drive it around again.

[lolder]

It sounds like a reasonable diagnosis. Hope they fix it. I used to get Mercury parts at the Ford dealer all the time. I can't imagine why they care. Maybe Lincoln lost out on warranty re-reimbursement. All of this should have been covered by the Lincoln hybrid vehicle warranty. Major work on low volume vehicles like your repair is frequently a nightmare. They've often never done it before. Like you, I have spent hours fixing routings of hoses and cables in years past when I had an 79 Olds diesel wagon that blew 3 head gaskets in the six months I owned it. The poor devil I sold it to ( then currently operating normally ) had another one blow a few months later. When they went to put the hood back on they dropped it through the windshield. That dealership mercifully died decades ago. If Tesla ever succeeds in eliminating the dealer chain, they'll own the future.

Edited July 11, 2014 by lolder

[Sleddog]

Why did you put up with him talking to you in that manner. I would have been running up one side of him then down the other. And when I finished, I would have been talking to his boss and then the owner.

 

Go to dealerrater.com and post your experience.

 

These dealers don't realize they are not the only game in town. There are 6 Ford dealers and 3 Lincoln dealers within a 40 mile radius of me. I have no problem changing up who sevices my fords.

 

Sales don't really make a dealership all that much money. Service is the golden goose. I just can't believe how many dealerships do thier best to strangle the life out of it.

 

Let us know what happens.

[acdii]

I deal with only one dealer for my service, whether is a Ford or Lincoln, doesnt matter. Only the shell and interior are different between them. The running gear and software are the same. I would have done the same thing you did, only I would have left that SA crying into his wheaties had he said that to me.

[11MKZ]

Alright final update. Lincoln dealer agreed that the coolant hose was the issue. They fixed it (after 4 days) and reimbursed my monies, also while reading the services they did while it was in looks like they fixed other issues that the body shop had done that I hadn't realized. They installed some fasteners to a splash shield and rerouted a wiring harness for a coolant sensor. Unfortunately I did not get a chance to talk to a manager my Fiancé and I were in a rush and grabbed the car and left. I will however post on dealerrater.com as I am not happy at all with how things have gone with them. We will not be taking the MKZ back to them and I hope from here on out I am able to fix the remaining issues that arise (I could have fixed this but why do that when I can bitch at them). If it ever needs serviced I will be taking it to the Ford dealer that did the first diagnostic I have a friend who used to work at the shop I am employed at who works there. He kept me updated the entire time it was there lol. Thanks for the input everyone.

[Robert McCann]

Hey, fellow hybrid owners! I have a problem. On July 1st I rear-ended another vehicle with my 2010 Fusion Hybrid. No airbag deployment, and I was able to drive the car to a body repair shop, where they proceeded to do about $7K in front-end component R&R. No issue with the engine was identified, and I picked up the car last Friday at noon. In the next 24 hours, I drove it about 15 miles in total, of which approximately 5 were on the highway, with no problem. However, on Saturday afternoon, I got on the highway for about a 35 mile trip. Approximately 10 miles in to the trip, the joint performance of the gasoline engine and the battery pack started going off-nominal. The gas engine began reving in a periodic fashion, triggered by pressing the accelerator. At the peak of the rev, the charge indicator on the charge display (the up-pointing arrowhead at the top of the display) would brighten, and then in the "valley" of the rev, the down-pointing (discharge) arrow would light up. This coupled behavior went on for the rest of the trip, but steadily got more noticeable (in mathematical terms, the amplitude of the periodic function increased), and eventually, the charge level for the battery pack dropped to zero. I didn't make it to my destination; trying to go uphill to reach a residence in San Francisco, the engine died. I was able to get it started again and got the car over to the curb. Flash forward to today. The car was towed back to the body shop, and they informed me that this afternoon they ran some diagnostics and got no error codes, and then road tested the vehicle without any recurrence of the problem. So, my question: has anybody ever experienced this kind of joint gas engine/battery pack failure? Thanks... whabbear@comcast.net