Newbie Questions (mostly maintenance)

[RWP]

Just took delivery of a 2014 Lincoln MKZ hybird. (Posting here because this is a much more active forum than the corresponding one for Lincoln...and there isn't a quarter's worth of difference between the cars, except, of course, the price!)

 

By way of background, I have driven mostly German cars over the past few years...BMW, Mercedes, and Mini. Although the routine service requirements on these vehicles have been substantially "dumbed down" from decades ago, it seems to me the Ford/Lincoln service schedule is unbelievably scant. (For BMW owners, I have always subscribed to Mike Miller's "old school maintenance" schedule, which is designed to keep the cars running into hundreds of thousands of miles, not just past the factory warranty/lease periods.) So any observations on the following would be welcome:

 

1. Seems to me the first oil change should be at around 1K not 5K as the dealer recommends. Sure, engine tolerances are tighter and today's oils are better, but there still has to be some microscopic metal shavings created during the break-in...so why not get rid of the quickly, rather than letting them grind away on engine surfaces? Also, why do they use semi-synthetic rather than full synthetic oil?

2. Brake fluid. BMW and Mercedes used to insist on yearly brake fluid flushes. Now it's down to two years. OK. I can live with that. But Ford/Lincoln says nothing about brake fluid. And the stuff is hygroscopic no matter what brand it's in.

3. Engine coolant. Ford/Lincoln says not until100K! Why not exchange that at least every four years?

4. Transmission fluid. 150K?? Are you kidding me? I have done it at 30K on the German cars without fail.

5. Spark plugs at 100K? With the crappy gasoline we have here, plugs start looking pretty bad at 30K.

 

Finally, I see this hybrid engine has a compression ratio of around 12 to 1, yet regular gas is specified. Back in the day, we could use regular gas up to about 8.5 to 1...but anything over 10 to 1 definitely required premium. I asked a dealership tech about this when I ran into him the day we got the car, and he basically said the car retards the timing to avoid detonation. So...why use a 12 to 1 compression ratio if you're just going to detune the motor? I have read a little about this Atkinson cycle engine but I don't really understand it.

 

Initial impressions of the car are very favorable. Love the comfort and quiet. The engine note is pretty ugly when it kicks in; with all their technology, you'd think the engineers could disguise the thing to sound like a full-throated V8!

 

MPG so far is around 42.

 

Great forum here. Thanks for all the helpful info. Still have a great deal to learn!

 

Bob

[hermans]

Just took delivery of a 2014 Lincoln MKZ hybird. (Posting here because this is a much more active forum than the corresponding one for Lincoln...and there isn't a quarter's worth of difference between the cars, except, of course, the price!)

I have one of each (FFH & MKZh) and I disagree with your statement.

[hybridbear]

Just took delivery of a 2014 Lincoln MKZ hybird. (Posting here because this is a much more active forum than the corresponding one for Lincoln...and there isn't a quarter's worth of difference between the cars, except, of course, the price!)

 

By way of background, I have driven mostly German cars over the past few years...BMW, Mercedes, and Mini. Although the routine service requirements on these vehicles have been substantially "dumbed down" from decades ago, it seems to me the Ford/Lincoln service schedule is unbelievably scant. (For BMW owners, I have always subscribed to Mike Miller's "old school maintenance" schedule, which is designed to keep the cars running into hundreds of thousands of miles, not just past the factory warranty/lease periods.) So any observations on the following would be welcome:

 

1. Seems to me the first oil change should be at around 1K not 5K as the dealer recommends. Sure, engine tolerances are tighter and today's oils are better, but there still has to be some microscopic metal shavings created during the break-in...so why not get rid of the quickly, rather than letting them grind away on engine surfaces? Also, why do they use semi-synthetic rather than full synthetic oil?

2. Brake fluid. BMW and Mercedes used to insist on yearly brake fluid flushes. Now it's down to two years. OK. I can live with that. But Ford/Lincoln says nothing about brake fluid. And the stuff is hygroscopic no matter what brand it's in.

3. Engine coolant. Ford/Lincoln says not until100K! Why not exchange that at least every four years?

4. Transmission fluid. 150K?? Are you kidding me? I have done it at 30K on the German cars without fail.

5. Spark plugs at 100K? With the crappy gasoline we have here, plugs start looking pretty bad at 30K.

 

Finally, I see this hybrid engine has a compression ratio of around 12 to 1, yet regular gas is specified. Back in the day, we could use regular gas up to about 8.5 to 1...but anything over 10 to 1 definitely required premium. I asked a dealership tech about this when I ran into him the day we got the car, and he basically said the car retards the timing to avoid detonation. So...why use a 12 to 1 compression ratio if you're just going to detune the motor? I have read a little about this Atkinson cycle engine but I don't really understand it.

 

Initial impressions of the car are very favorable. Love the comfort and quiet. The engine note is pretty ugly when it kicks in; with all their technology, you'd think the engineers could disguise the thing to sound like a full-throated V8!

 

MPG so far is around 42.

 

Great forum here. Thanks for all the helpful info. Still have a great deal to learn!

 

Bob

Bob - Welcome & congrats on the MKZh!

 

If you want to do an early oil change, then go for it. I did, for the same reason you mention above. Even if there are less metal shavings in modern engines, I sleep better at night knowing I did the first oil change early. Oil changes aren't expensive, so go for it. Just remember, the ICE is only running half the time or less. If you drive a lot of city miles the ICE might only run 30% of your miles. For that reason, 10k mile standard oil change intervals are more like changing oil every 4k in a conventional car.

 

As far as brake fluid, you will hardly use the brake pads in the hybrid so you should be able to get 100k miles easy out of your brake pads/rotors if you have a high brake score. Since brake fluid often is changed at the same time as you change pads/rotors it makes sense for other manufacturers to say 2 years since that is likely all you get out of your brakes.

 

Coolant - this car has two separate cooling systems, one for the ICE and one for the hybrid components. Since the ICE runs less often, the coolant has to work less. In 20k miles of driving in the FFH, I don't think the coolant has once gotten hot enough to turn the radiator fan on. The hybrid cooling system operates 100% of the time the car is on. I would think that the hybrid coolant would need changing more often since that coolant circulates more.

 

The eCVT transmission design is elegant and simple compared to the transmissions in your past cars. The Ford design has only a few moving parts and thus needs virtually no maintenance. Nothing stops you from changing it sooner, but the simplicity of the eCVT design means less stress on the fluid and less contamination of it. The FFH/MKZh don't have a transmission fluid dipstick, so you can't check level or see how dirty the fluid is. The system is completely sealed.

 

Spark plugs - remember, the ICE only runs 30-50% of your miles. So 100k on the odometer will really only be 30k-50k on the ICE. Since the ICE is almost never on at idle it's really even less wear on the ICE and spark plugs etc than a conventional car would have after 30-50k because you have less hours of ICE run time. Check out this thread for what one member found when he checked his spark plugs at 14k miles.

 

Modern engines are able to use lower octanes with higher compression. The ICE timing is only retarded when the ICE first comes on and is cold. This is common on all vehicles. When you're driving the timing is not retarded and the engine is not detuned. Some hybrid owners have experimented with higher octane gas and have reported that they get better MPGs with Premium gas, but none have found the added cost to be worth the increased MPGs. No one has claimed that there is a difference in ICE performance with higher octane gas.

Edited January 1, 2014 by hybridbear

[kbailey990]

Hi RWP,

 

Welcome and congratulations, and happy new year! There are many Lincoln hybrid owners here and they can be very helpful.

 

Several of our members are extremely knowledgeable, and can address your specific technical questions, but one thing I wanted to mention about maintenance mileage.

 

Remember you new car will run a substantial amount of miles in electric mode, with the ICE off. That increases the oil change increment all by itself. Also, the regen brakes slow you down by charging the battery instead of using up the break pads.

 

This is a perfect place to learn much more about your great new car!

[RWP]

Appreciate the thoughtful replies. They make good sense.

 

I based my comment about the similarities on reviews...many of which seemed to favor the Fusion over the MKZ. I like the MKZ for the nice, bright LED headlights. Used to Xenon and halogens just don't cut it any more. Hermans, How would you describe the differences between the two?

[hermans]

Differences include seat comfort (I have the luxury pkg in the FFH). I've taken 1200+ trips in both car and I actually feel better, physically, after driving 600 miles in the MKHz.The Lincoln is much quieter. I can adjust the suspension in the Lincoln. I have the best radio available, at the time, in my FFH and the THX in the Lincoln....no comparison. The warranty is better on the Lincoln.

 

I have the '13 FFH SE with every option available except for Parking Assist....I didn't want it. The Ti was not available at the time and if it was, I still would not have gotten one. The MKZ is loaded with every option available on the 2013. I love both cars and would make the same buying decisions all over again. Even the Parking Assist on the Lincoln as my wife drives the car and she uses it....I don't.

[acdii]

Engine manufacturing today is nothing like it was in the past. Each engine is actually run up and seated before they ever leave the plant, so any crud is flushed out during the run in. Your first oil fill is actually the second when you get it, thats why you dont see a break in oil change. It is pretty neat to see this too. After the engine is assembled and before the pan is installed, they hook it up to a machine that pumps air into the engine to run it up, while lubricant is pumped through the system. This seats the rings and flushes out all the passages. The machine also tells them if something is not right with the engine based on how it performs. Once it passes the test, they install the pan and send it down the line to be shipped or installed.

 

That and todays oils are so much better than in the past that they do last longer even under extreme conditions.

 

As for the ICE, its not an Otto engine like in a normal car, one of those at 12:1 without a Supercharger or Turbo does require higher octane, but the ICE in the hybrid is an Atkinson cycle, the compression is variable with the valve timing. At peak its 12:1, but under most driving conditions its lower as the intake valve stays open during the compression stroke. http://auto.howstuffworks.com/atkinson-cycle-engine1.htm This is why it doesn't require higher octane fuel.

 

Spark plugs are made of much better materials these day and with the computer systems and fuel injection, along with cleaner burning fuels and tighter engines, they last much longer. It has been the norm now for over a decade to go 100K on spark plugs In fact on our 1995 Grand Marquis, the plugs have been changed once over 135K miles.

[bsondhi]

Hi RWP

 

I have a Lexus and Toyota prior to buying FFH (Most beautiful car on planet). Most of schedules are fairly similar. Looks like you have been burning too much money with Germans.

 

- As acdii mentioned, most car comes with a second oil and do not require brake in any more. Lexus did not require any oil change till 7.5K. Even regular Fusion(non-hybrid) does not require before 10k. (My colleague has one and he has over 50K on the car with 10K interval.)

- Brake Fluid: Most ICE based cars with friction brakes require 2 year bleed and fill. I agree the usage of brakes is much much lower. As a word of precaution, I would change it every 3 years. I follow the same rule on my Lexus and have no problems.

- Most cars come with Engine Coolant good for 90K. I have not checked the color on FFH but Lexus uses pink color one. At 60K (Lexus) I did visual compare and did not see anything to worry on the coolant. I am going to change it once I reach 90K (lexus).

- Tansmission Fluid - 150K looks fine considering the engine only runs 50% of the time. Even in Lexus it does not require before 105K.

- Not sure what are they using in FFH but the ones in Lexus were Iridium which is rated over 120K. Even if you use Platinum Spark Plugs (most cars do) you do not need anything before 90K.

- Also I am with you, I am using 91 Octane to be on safe side. I see the car has given me 44.9 MPG so far.

At this rate, you can use the spare money for a nice weekend get away with your significant other.

Enjoy the ride.

peace

B

Edited January 2, 2014 by bsondhi

[Sleddog]

Wow... 91 octane? You're just wasting your money. But it's your money to waste. My lifetime is 50.8 mpg, with 5500 miles. My current tank is 53.2 mpg. My highest was over 54. I run 87 and use the cheapest I can find.

[acdii]

I use 89, but thats only because its the lowest grade at the station I go to, and happens to be where the first tanks came from. Since I rarely ever get gas anywhere else I cant tel you if it helps MPG or not.

[inco]

It's topics like this and the discussion that follows that certainly attracts me to this site. I'm not only old school, but also old and I would want to change my oil within the first 1,000 miles had I not come here.

 

I'm really looking forward to the arrival of my FFH and being able to come here and learn and share experiences. Great site and a source of very good information. :victory:

[hybridbear]

It's topics like this and the discussion that follows that certainly attracts me to this site. I'm not only old school, but also old and I would want to change my oil within the first 1,000 miles had I not come here.

 

I'm really looking forward to the arrival of my FFH and being able to come here and learn and share experiences. Great site and a source of very good information. :victory:

We look forward to learning from your experiences :)

[inco]

Me too, of course I need some help from Ashley and Ford to make that happen! Still waiting to see if the car has been freed from that frozen rail car to be delivered. Mind you it's so cold here today even the Explorer doesn't want to move.! ;(

[bsondhi]

Wow... 91 octane? You're just wasting your money. But it's your money to waste. My lifetime is 50.8 mpg, with 5500 miles. My current tank is 53.2 mpg. My highest was over 54. I run 87 and use the cheapest I can find.

Hi Bud - What's your magic? We live in not so cold area and I am getting 44-45 range. Do you drive long range or short range? Our's is mostly driven for short distance of 5 miles or so.

[hybridbear]

Hi Bud - What's your magic? We live in not so cold area and I am getting 44-45 range. Do you drive long range or short range? Our's is mostly driven for short distance of 5 miles or so.

Short trips kill MPG. If you read about the ICE warm-up here you'll understand more of what happens during those short trips and why it hurts MPG. 45 MPG tank average for mostly 5 mile trips is very good. If your trips were mostly 15 miles instead of 5 I bet you'd see 50+ MPG.

[Sleddog]

Hi Bud - What's your magic? We live in not so cold area and I am getting 44-45 range. Do you drive long range or short range? Our's is mostly driven for short distance of 5 miles or so.

You have more hills have I do. I'm in Florida. My daily drive is about 28 miles one way. So 56 round trip. It's a combination of 35 mph zone with stoplights and some 45, 50, and 55 to 60 mph areas. I'd say more than half is 45 and over. I use the ECO cruise when possible. I try not be break 2 kw power demand when accelerating. And I take advantage of what little terrian elevation changes we have. There is one area that the speed limit changes from 45 to 50 than 55 all in about 3/4 of mile. It starts coming down an overpass, so I use the speed increase (set +) on the ECO cruise to accelerate. Other than that, it's the normal hybrid driving techniques. My last 1.5 miles to home and 3/4 to work are 35 mph zones. As I get close to those areas, I keep the SOC high so I can drive those distances on battery. I usually have some charge left, so when I leave for work in the morning or to go home, in the afternoon, I get some drive time on just the battery before the ICE starts.

 

I have also found the battery appears to perform best when the outside air temp is between 76 to 84. Outside of those temp, I see some drop off of mileage. But I can sometimes compensate for that by leaving a few minutes earlier in the morning or later in the afternoon to miss some of the traffic. Stop and go traffic also effects my mileage, but I can make up those losses by adjusting my speed in the non stoplight areas.

 

I some time make a stop in the morning that's about 10 miles into the my drive. My trip mileage to that stop is sometimes as low as 40 mpg. But my last 18 miles is usually 68 mpg +. It's beause the second trip does in involve warming the ICE.

Edited January 4, 2014 by Sleddog

[inco]

"I have also found the battery appears to perform best when the outside air temp is between 76 to 84." :drool:

 

Oh boy do I have a long wait for that to happen. Maybe June and then by October it's history. So four months of good mileage and eight terrible. Hmm, maybe I did something wrong by staying here. Today it's -5F and that is really warm compared to yesterday's -26. :)

[bsondhi]

Thanks Sled!

 

We live in a hilly area though not extreme. I have also experienced what you mentioned for ECO when I am travelling 15 miles or more distance. Due to hills I cannot attain more than 45-47mpg. I will take the hills than being in -5 weather.