MPG "tanking" in the cold weather - others?

[Craig]

Bought my 2013 Fusion Hybrid in April so was heading into the warm weather. At the end of October the lifetime MPG was 43.7. Pretty nice after 7500 miles.

 

Now it is dropping quickly in the cold weather- I live in Wisconsin. Just since November the lifetime average has dropped to 42. That's significant erosion in a very few miles.

 

Is this to be expected? Others experience?

 

Craig

[Fos01]

Sure is... I'm experiencing the same issue. It has to do with the ICE starting to create heat to warm the system. It is killing my MPGs... Are you running your heater immediately after you start the FFH?

[Fos01]

Craig,

I'm trying to find the gauge to monitor the ICE coolant temp. Can you give me any help here?

[GrySql]

Craig,

I'm trying to find the gauge to monitor the ICE coolant temp. Can you give me any help here?

Page 86 in the FFH owner's Manual.

Using the left Display, select My View and continue pushing the right arrow until you reach Menu Level 5, select Coolant Temp.

 

Or, use the Engineering Test Mode by pushing and holding down the steering wheel's left 'OK' button while you start the car, continue holding until the ETM window appears in the left Display.

Use the 'up' and 'down arrows until you find the Coolant Temps.

You can drive the car that way.

Edited December 8, 2013 by GrySql

[Craig]

Fos01 and GrySql:

 

I leave my heat set to auto so that it warms up when it is ready. It was -11 here this morning. Thanks for the engineering answer! I wouldn't have a clue. Can I view oil temp too?

 

Craig

[Fos01]

I'm considering putting on a grill cover to help control the air flow... There is a lot of discussion on grill covers.

 

Another forum member recommended the following link...

 

http://fordfusionhyb...-blocking-more/

 

 

 

[hybridbear]

Bought my 2013 Fusion Hybrid in April so was heading into the warm weather. At the end of October the lifetime MPG was 43.7. Pretty nice after 7500 miles.

 

Now it is dropping quickly in the cold weather- I live in Wisconsin. Just since November the lifetime average has dropped to 42. That's significant erosion in a very few miles.

 

Is this to be expected? Others experience?

 

Craig

MPGs drop a lot in winter. Our average was over 50 MPG in summer in MN but around 40 MPG in winter. Year-round we averaged about 46 MPG.

 

Check out this thread.

 

You can also warm up the ICE faster by following the procedure mentioned here to skip Stage 1a of ICE warm-up. Warming up the ICE more quickly will allow it to shut off more quickly.

 

If you bought your car in Wisconsin then it should have an Engine Block Heater. Use it. It makes a big difference. Today the outside temp was -5F but the coolant was already about 25C/77F because of having the block heater plugged in. When temps are more moderate (20+ F) the block heater can heat the coolant to about 40-45C/104-113F. Since the coolant must be at least 40C for the ICE to turn off it makes a huge difference starting with coolant that is 80 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than the ambient temp.

[ptjones]

I will be sending out 3 sets of Grill Covers Monday so members should have them Wednesday. Looking forward to their reactions too. I would recommend ScanGauge to monitor what going on with ICE and MPG's. :)

 

Paul

[Craig]

Thanks hybrid bear. No engine block heater but I keep the garage warmer than outside. Probably a good idea to not have heat set to auto at the outset.

Craig

[wmpwi]

Michigan Highway Trip last night

 

Vehicle: 2014 FFH < 1,000 miles

Fuel level: Topped off

Distance: 125

Exterior Temp: 13

Wind speed: Near 0

Average Speed: 76

Cruse: On

Eco: On

Interior Temp: 73 (Auto)

Road Conditions: Clean / Dry

Traffic: Very Lite

Tire pressure: Factory default

Mileage: 32.4

Disposition: Comfortable

 

Yeah, mileage seemed like it really sucked for the first 1/2 hour, but it seemed to go up after a while. I can't imagine what it's going to do w/ snow yet.

 

Bought my 2013 Fusion Hybrid in April so was heading into the warm weather. At the end of October the lifetime MPG was 43.7. Pretty nice after 7500 miles.

Now it is dropping quickly in the cold weather- I live in Wisconsin. Just since November the lifetime average has dropped to 42. That's significant erosion in a very few miles.

Is this to be expected? Others experience?

Craig

Edited December 8, 2013 by wmpwi

[MaineFusion]

I've found the heat system can really drop my MPG. One way I deal with this is to leave the heat system off for the first five minutes or so. I'll also turn it back off about five minutes from my destination. This helps a little. I also resist using the seat heater unless it is wicked cold out.

 

My biggest MPG hit is when it is raining hard or the roads are really slushy. Pure snow/ice isn't too bad because traffic slows down so much that the lower speeds make up for my loss in MPG due to the cold.

[acdii]

This morning it was 1*, and I noticed the car slows down a LOT faster when its this cold. Really strange how that happens, even with 80% charge, so must be the fluids or the tires doing it. Where I would normally be on the brakes slowing down, didn't have to touch them and the car was slowing quicker than when I had to use the brakes. I think this factors in more than the cabin heater since the ICE and EV have to overcome this friction or whatever the heck it is. To add to this I also notice about a 4-6 MPG difference on the same roads when on ICE with 80%+ charge. Normally its at or above 40 MPG on this one stretch, but with the really cold temps below 20, it is more around 37 MPG.

 

Do grill covers help, YES!!!!! With it being so cold out, the ICE does heat up quicker and provide more cabin heat, without them the ICE would stay cool and run more often. This morning was the first time ICE kicked on when I was nearly at my office and not because of low SOC, even in EV+ it kicked on, only to provide cabin heat.

 

Hey HB, if you have a place to plug in a block heater, why didn't you get an Energi?

[hybridbear]

I've found the heat system can really drop my MPG. One way I deal with this is to leave the heat system off for the first five minutes or so. I'll also turn it back off about five minutes from my destination. This helps a little. I also resist using the seat heater unless it is wicked cold out.

 

My biggest MPG hit is when it is raining hard or the roads are really slushy. Pure snow/ice isn't too bad because traffic slows down so much that the lower speeds make up for my loss in MPG due to the cold.

Seat heaters consume less energy that the HVAC system takes from the ICE temp. Using seat heaters is a great way to limit how much HVAC you need. Seat heaters pull very little current. In the ScanGauge thread I believe I measured it and commented on it.

 

Hey HB, if you have a place to plug in a block heater, why didn't you get an Energi?

I plug in the block heater when I'm at my parents house in their garage. Other than that I don't use it. Since I usually go visit them and help them with stuff around their house every Saturday I am able to plug in the block heater each Saturday.

[MaineFusion]

We were in single digits today. Going to work I was able to get about 42mpg, but coming home I was less than 40mpg. In part I was a little less tolerant of cold this afternoon and use the HVAC and seat heater more. I was also driving a little faster on the trip home. Another factor may have been that my car sits in a garage that never goes below freezing so the car started a little warmer than in the afternoon where it had cooled down to the teens by the time I started it to drive home.

 

Supposedly we're supposed to get hit by a nor'easter this weekend. Thank goodness I have Monday off.

 

I am so done with winter and we haven't even reached the winter solstice.

 

After living for eight years in Alaska and 13 years in Maine, I can boil my winter survival skills down to two words: "stay indoors!"

Edited December 13, 2013 by MaineFusion

[acdii]

I agree, when its this cold, screw MPG, Crank up the heat for my feet! Whats funny is the past few days I have not been driving economically yet still managing to do pretty good. Still managing to hit between my expected 38-43 mark. This one is doing what I had hoped for, getting better then my 2010 in the cold and snow. Who would have thought 10 year ago that a 5 passenger family sedan could even GET 40 MPG, let alone 47! At best they got 25.

[ptjones]

We were in single digits today. Going to work I was able to get about 42mpg, but coming home I was less than 40mpg. In part I was a little less tolerant of cold this afternoon and use the HVAC and seat heater more. I was also driving a little faster on the trip home. Another factor may have been that my car sits in a garage that never goes below freezing so the car started a little warmer than in the afternoon where it had cooled down to the teens by the time I started it to drive home.

 

Supposedly we're supposed to get hit by a nor'easter this weekend. Thank goodness I have Monday off.

 

I am so done with winter and we haven't even reached the winter solstice.

 

After living for eight years in Alaska and 13 years in Maine, I can boil my winter survival skills down to two words: "stay indoors!"

You should really try covering up your grill, you don't have to freeze. :)

BTW what happened to Fuelly numbers? :shift:

 

Paul

[MaineFusion]

You should really try covering up your grill, you don't have to freeze. :)

BTW what happened to Fuelly numbers? :shift:

 

Paul

I'm not too keen to use something like a grill cover unless it is staying below zero for a long period of time.

 

As far a my Fuelly numbers go, ya dropping out of the 50mpg club kinda sucks.

[ptjones]

I'm not too keen to use something like a grill cover unless it is staying below zero for a long period of time.

 

As far a my Fuelly numbers go, ya dropping out of the 50mpg club kinda sucks.

MaineFusion set your myview for EMPOWER and Temp and then tape up your grill. At your temps you will be lucky to get to the middle of the gauge with tape on it, so you are just wasting gas if the ICE doesn't get up to operating temp(202-212 according to FORD). I can't see that there is anyway you could over heat your ICE, I would be interested knowing how it is possible to do. BTW the top white line on the temp gauge is about 245degrees. :)

 

Paul

[MaineFusion]

Paul,

 

I have a better gas saving idea, I just need to telecommute more days per week!

[hybridbear]

I'm not too keen to use something like a grill cover unless it is staying below zero for a long period of time.

 

As far a my Fuelly numbers go, ya dropping out of the 50mpg club kinda sucks.

Blocking the top grille will help, Ken. Even if the temp isn't below 0 the amount of time the FFH spends in EV mode has a big impact on temps. Watch the coolant gauge on MyView like Paul recommends. You'll see how in winter the temp gauge never makes it to the middle (>180F) when you have the heat on in winter. A cold ICE sucks down more fuel.

Edited December 14, 2013 by hybridbear

[MaineFusion]

Okay, today's commute to work with the temps in the minus teens had me wishing for a grille cover.

[hybridbear]

Okay, today's commute to work with the temps in the minus teens had me wishing for a grille cover.

Half inch foam insulation fits well in the grille. Below is a pic of how I blocked the grille on the C-Max Energi for my parents. If you can get dark colored foam insulation it blends in quite well. I cut the pieces to fit the length of the opening and then also cut slits to fit around the vertical slats of the grille. You then crush the insulation flat and stick it in there. The pieces are very solid in there, but are easy to remove as needed when the temperature warms. The nice thing with foam insulation is that you can remove one piece at a time when the temp warms instead of having to remove all or nothing like you do with the plastic grille cover. Foam insulation is cheap too! I paid under $3 for the pack that I used to block the entire grille on the Energi.

 

[No1hedberg]

I understand what all of you are saying about the ICE, but I think that part of the decrease in mileage has to do with the inherent inefficiency of batteries in cold temperatures. Batteries discharge faster, recharge slower, and store less energy when cold. Also Winter blend gas compounds the problem like it does with all gasoline engines.

[acdii]

I understand what all of you are saying about the ICE, but I think that part of the decrease in mileage has to do with the inherent inefficiency of batteries in cold temperatures. Batteries discharge faster, recharge slower, and store less energy when cold. Also Winter blend gas compounds the problem like it does with all gasoline engines.

This is a given fact, but if you were to do a comparison between grill cover on and off in the cold, it becomes quite apparent the benefit of the cover. It can make as much as a 60* temp difference, or more. There was one time after an hour driving in 5* weather that the coolant was as low as 128*. A hotter engine burns fuel more efficiently, and extended EV modes drop that core temp quickly so the ICE must run more often just to bring the temps up, even if you have a full SOC on the pack. When the ICE is off, coolant isnt flowing, and that cold air entering the grill cools off the coolant in the radiator, so when the ICE kicks back on it sucks in cold coolant until the thermostat closes, then has to make up that lost heat by richening the fuel. It's a viscous cycle since its one of the only ones that will shut off the ICE at high speeds, older Hybrids like the 10-12 FFH were always on at highway speeds, and didnt really need a grill cover, at least mine didnt, had I covered the grill it might have done better in the winter than it did, but I was content with the MPG it was getting.

Edited December 19, 2013 by acdii

[No1hedberg]

This is a given fact, but if you were to do a comparison between grill cover on and off in the cold, it becomes quite apparent the benefit of the cover. It can make as much as a 60* temp difference, or more. There was one time after an hour driving in 5* weather that the coolant was as low as 128*. A hotter engine burns fuel more efficiently, and extended EV modes drop that core temp quickly so the ICE must run more often just to bring the temps up, even if you have a full SOC on the pack. When the ICE is off, coolant isnt flowing, and that cold air entering the grill cools off the coolant in the radiator, so when the ICE kicks back on it sucks in cold coolant until the thermostat closes, then has to make up that lost heat by richening the fuel. It's a viscous cycle since its one of the only ones that will shut off the ICE at high speeds, older Hybrids like the 10-12 FFH were always on at highway speeds, and didnt really need a grill cover, at least mine didnt, had I covered the grill it might have done better in the winter than it did, but I was content with the MPG it was getting.

 

That makes sense. Mine is a '12 so it runs all the time anyway. It is startling the drop during cold temps.