Ford's marketing of the FFH & C-Max

[hybridbear]

I want to take issue with Ford's marketing of the Fusion and C-Max. Just like in Who Killed the Electric Car? it talks about how the automakers didn't really educate consumers or advertise the electric vehicles we see the same thing today with hybrids and PHEVs. If Ford really wanted to sell the Fusion Hybrid/Energi and C-Max Hybrid/Energi they would target their marketing at people who weren't previously considering hybrids/PHEVs and show them the advantages of these vehicles. But, they don't do this. Ford only advertises the C-Max as a Prius killer trying to convince people that it is better than the Prius. If you were not previously considering a Prius then this advertising is wasted on you. Also, many people have a negative image of the Prius in their mind, linking the C-Max with the Prius in advertising is not going to sell C-Maxes to those people. The Fusion Hybrid is advertised like a footnote at the end of the regular Fusion commercials and nothing is done to tout the benefits of the Fusion Hybrid in comparison with the gas Fusion.

 

Also, where is the advertising for the Energi models??!? I have seen nothing other than the banner on Ford's website that occasionally displays the C-Max Energi and Fusion Hybrid when going to Ford.com.

 

There is a scene in Who Killed the Electric Car? that mentions how GM went about contacting people who were interested in buying the EV1 and telling them all the limitations of the vehicle and then proceeding to claim that no one wanted it. Nowadays there is not enough done to advertise the benefits of buying a Fusion Hybrid over buying a Fusion EB. There appears to be ZERO advertising about the benefits of buying an Energi model over buying a gas only vehicle. This is very disappointing.

 

A few months ago I made a comment about how I'm not convinced that Ford really wants to sell these cars because of how they had to know that there would be an uproar about the real world fuel economy. I don't think that the engineers, marketing people and executives at Ford are so stupid that they didn't expect some backlash for building a car to ACE the EPA tests that would thus perform worse for many people in real life. When regular cars that are not built to ace the EPA tests often perform worse in real life for some drivers and better for others there is no way that Ford could have thought that what they did wouldn't cause an outrage from disappointed consumers. It seems that just about all consumers are disappointed. Experienced hypermilers are unable to exceed the EPA ratings in the Ford hybrids like they can in other hybrids. Regular consumers are getting much worse than they expected. And even I am a bit disappointed. I tried to not expect better than 47 MPG overall, but when our past cars have all done better than EPA estimates consistently it is hard to not expect that this car will also exceed those numbers. Sadly we're at 42.1 Lifetime on the dash and have found the city mileage to be more than 47 MPG but the highway mileage to be worse. And I am a bit disappointed.

 

Cognizant of how consumers would react, I question how much they actually wanted to sell the cars...looking at the advertising I also question how much they want to sell the PHEVs. If we think about it, the hybrids and PHEVs and BEVs hurt the Ford dealers. Since we need to change oil less often in our hybrids than a gas car, that costs the dealerships money and costs Ford income from selling parts. Since we need brakes less often we also bring in less long-term revenue. A PHEV is even more extreme with the lack of oil changes and a BEV has no oil changes period, and no other routine maintenance associated with an ICE.

 

This makes me worry that maybe the automakers have engineered the batteries to fail at a certain point, say 100,000 miles since that is beyond warranty outside of California, and then they're hoping to make up this lost revenue replacing battery packs. Since we're driving the first year of cars with a NEW battery pack design who knows what changes have been made. The old NiMH packs were proven to last a long time, but we don't know that about the Li-Ion packs yet. This makes me nervous.

 

I'm not a conspiracy nut, but I try to be realistic. This whole world is corrupt. The system is broken. And who's to say that this isn't going on...

 

Your thoughts?

Edited May 1, 2013 by hybridbear

[corncobs]

Actually I saw a CMax commercial I believe in Utah. A cowboy lassoing the charging plug into the car.

Edited May 1, 2013 by corncobs

[acdii]

Well most of you already know my position on this. As far as Ford is concerned, if the car can get within set parameters on a series of test drives, which during the tests do a couple things to get the mileage, like getting the car fully warmed up by driving it for a few hours, and driving it in an extreme manner that the majority of drivers would never drive, they will tell you no problem found. If you are a current hybrid owner, and unless its an exact model of the complaint car, they refuse to associate it with the case. They really dont care if you can get above EPA in any other car, as long as in their test drives it gets within a certain range. The best they did on my car was 42 MPG, yet when I drove my 2010 the same way on the same roads in the same temps I was able to do the same, which is well above EPA for the 10.

 

Now when I see a Fusion commercial, I change the channel. This is the main reason for that lawsuit in progress, not the fact that it doesnt get EPA, but because Ford is advertising it as getting 47 when in fact they are far below it, and fuelly is backing up their claims too. Out of all the cars I have driven, the new Fusion is the only one I have not been able to get EPA in other than a few fluke trips, but when calculating out the tank trips they are so far below that I doubt those trips were anywhere near accurate.

 

It's these things that I feel are keeping Ford from advertising the PHEV or Hybrid more than they are now, They know! Also you are right about the Prius image, those looking to get a Prius may give the Cmax a look, but Toyota has an in stone reputation of great reliability, and years of strong service records, and that will be very hard to beat, which will grab most potential Cmax sales from Ford, and those who dislike the Prius image would steer away from it too.

 

What is going to kick Ford in the nethers is the highway MPG. too unrealistic. They may be able to get EPA 47 in the highway tests, but so far real world Interstate driving is proving it to be far below it. City driving it does quite well in, no question there, its the highway that it is having issues with, and it wasnt just my car, but there appear to be quite a few who are replicating what I had too, just not as bad.

[HenryVIII]

Hybridbear, you made some very valid points. However, I also think they may be waiting on EPA results as well (not sure on the status of that if someone would like to chime in on that). That said you are on point about the Cmax, bad targeting. They shouldn't even compare it to the Prius. They should target it as a fuel-efficient oversized Focus that offers cargo capacity.

 

As far as maintenance goes, I always follow what the book says, not what the dealer says. Never get sucked into flushes, waste of money. Maintenance on a hybrid should be minimal, which is good. Little should need to be done, just gas, oil, tire rotations (and new tire changes), air filters (cabin filters too) along with trans fluid changes. I would still do 100k mile services. Remember that Hybrid engines do start up and shut down a lot more than their all-gas counterparts. That is wear and tear. I would still follow your 100k services (coolant changes, fluid changes, spark plugs, etc.). I see the extended benefit of hybrids as far as maintenance goes is extended braking service and extended oil change intervals depending on your driving style (YMMV).

[hybridbear]

Check out this quote from a review of the C-Max:

 

"Could it be that Ford built both the C-Max Hybrid and the Fusion Hybrid not with the goal of outselling either the Prius or the Camry Hybrid, but rather in an attempt to bolster its Corporate Average Fuel Economy rating? A pair of EPA-estimated 47-mpg models would certainly do just that, even if real-world performance falls well under the tested average."

 

See the full review here:

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/05/02/2013-ford-c-max-hybrid-review/

[acdii]

It does hold water! When you consider that the 10-12 MY FFH can easily meet the ratings, mainly because there is a RANGE, but the new versions are hard to get up to the 47 mark, and some fall far below it, it sure makes one sit back and think about it that way.

[fusionTX]

I

 

A few months ago I made a comment about how I'm not convinced that Ford really wants to sell these cars because of how they had to know that there would be an uproar about the real world fuel economy. I don't think that the engineers, marketing people and executives at Ford are so stupid that they didn't expect some backlash for building a car to ACE the EPA tests that would thus perform worse for many people in real life. When regular cars that are not built to ace the EPA tests often perform worse in real life for some drivers and better for others there is no way that Ford could have thought that what they did wouldn't cause an outrage from disappointed consumers. It seems that just about all consumers are disappointed. Experienced hypermilers are unable to exceed the EPA ratings in the Ford hybrids like they can in other hybrids. Regular consumers are getting much worse than they expected. And even I am a bit disappointed. I tried to not expect better than 47 MPG overall, but when our past cars have all done better than EPA estimates consistently it is hard to not expect that this car will also exceed those numbers. Sadly we're at 42.1 Lifetime on the dash and have found the city mileage to be more than 47 MPG but the highway mileage to be worse. And I am a bit disappointed.

 

Your thoughts?

I agree with a lot of what you say. I cannot give Ford a pass for designing a car to ace the EPA tests. I cannot help but think that the Fusion, with all its new technology and battery, could have been better designed to give better real world mileage. It will be interesting to see what changes will be made going forward.

 

That being said, long before I got my car, I had enough information to know what I was getting with the Fusion. Of course, I am not your average Joe, I am here every day, reading everything I can get my hands on. I knew highway mileage would be slightly disappointing. I had to weigh that against all the other car attributes, and I decided the Fusion was still the car for me.

 

Having finished my first long distance trip, I can say that my Fusion is almost equal, maybe a little less efficient than my 2007 Camry Hybrid on long high speed trips. The Camry I would drive up to 80 MPG. i did not push the Fusion above 75, although my partner did at times. He doesn't use the ACC (don't ask me why), and his speeds fluctuate more than mine. That hurt mileage some, I think.

 

So it's not a great car if you do a lot of high speed highway driving. My lifetime is now down to 35 MPG. It was at 43 before my trip to Florida. But if your commute is mainly city with an occasional trip here and there, it's a fantastic car. I may rest my lifetime, now that the trip is over, as it was a bit unfair on the car to subject it to that long trip so early on.

 

Since I take two of these long trips to Florida every year, I would prefer a car that does better on these trips. It can't be good for these small engines to drive them at 3000 RPM for extended periods. Many portions of I-10 have a 75 MPH speed limit. So going 80, should be the norm.

[hybridbear]

On the C-Max Hybrid Forum they're talking about this too, so it isn't just me lol

[GrySql]

Not that this is a big Ad campaign but in my travels all over the southern CA freeways there are quite a few billboards that picture the Energi or C-max and the words,"LA to San Diego and back on <$20 of gas" and a big Ford oval and the car names. I've never seen a TV Ad for either.

[hybridbear]

Ford might have gotten the message. This new C-Max commercial is awesome!

http://www.ispot.tv/ad/7ffr/ford-c-max-switch-sal-and-family

 

Ford should have been doing this since the beginning!

[corncobs]

Ford might have gotten the message. This new C-Max commercial is awesome!

http://www.ispot.tv/ad/7ffr/ford-c-max-switch-sal-and-family

 

Ford should have been doing this since the beginning!

I think all new Ford commercials are better than before (F150 maybe not so much) but C-Max, Fusion, Edge are the once that I have seen so far now that we are finally back home :)

[acdii]

The lincoln commercials hit target. The Ford commercials starting during Christmas were MUCH better.

[corncobs]

Have you guys and gals seen the newest National commercial?

It features a RR Ford Fusion (maybe SB) for a fashion consultant :)

 

 

http://www.ispot.tv/ad/768y/national-car-rental-fashion-consultant

Edited January 21, 2014 by corncobs

[tr7driver]

Have you guys and gals seen the newest National commercial?

It features a RR Ford Fusion (maybe SB) for a fashion consultant :)

 

 

http://www.ispot.tv/ad/768y/national-car-rental-fashion-consultant

This one caught my eye watching the playoff games.

[acdii]

Thats a Sunset. Remarkable color when seen with black wheels and the sun hits it just right. Ford has better commercials now, even the Cmax is being advertised, and this time around they are going after the Prius not for fuel economy but for creature comforts and handling.

[hybridbear]

Ford Hybrid SuperBowl commercial

http://youtu.be/siDnN_iyPU0

 

Here is a small article review of the ad: http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/super-bowl-xlviii-ad-rob-riggle-compares-ford-hybrids-to-a-griffin-ar162141.html

[corncobs]

Those are some cool teasers.

[corncobs]

Well it locks like Ford has used all the money they have saved on previous commercials to put back into the Super Bowl advertisement.

 

It's very cool that they focus on "our" FFH. It's going to be seen where this is going.

 

Have fun watching Super Bowl XLVIII.

 

Edit:

 

Well not much more then the two ads I'm a bit disappointed how about you guys.

Edited February 3, 2014 by corncobs

[B25Nut]

I thought the commercials were excellent. The lead-ins weren't necessary, but every scene with the car made me proud to be a FFH owner. They picked the best angles to show it off, and the Tuxedo Black looked amazing. I think the commercials got the attention of potential buyers. A little fluff is required to do that. It was in the top three of the car ads, in my opinion, along with the Jaguar F-Type and the Chrysler 200, which had the best message (let the Asians build your cell phones, we'll build your cars).

[hybridbear]

Are the commercials online? I missed them and it would be cool to see them.

[acdii]

Are the commercials online? I missed them and it would be cool to see them.

There was a link to them on the Google search page.

[hybridbear]

My dad and I went to the Twin Cities Auto Show today. I was disappointed in the Ford display. They had one Fusion Hybrid S (out of 4 Fusions), one C-Max Hybrid, but no Energi models at the Ford display; and there was one MKZ Hybrid at the Lincoln display (out of 5 MKZs). In the special "Green Room" they had a C-Max Energi and Fusion Energi (but the Fusion Energi was locked so you couldn't get in it :cry:). I sure wish they would display more of them. I overhead a number of people asking the Ford employees about the hybrid/Energi models. I listened to couple of the Ford employees explaining about them and, while they did better than most dealership employees, they didn't do a very good job selling the potential customers on the advantages of the hybrids. One even just reverted to talking about the Ecoboost Fusion, ignoring the request for information about the hybrid. When the Ford employees won't even promote the hybrids when a potential customer asks for information about them, that says a lot and is extremely disappointing.

[acdii]

Time to send a letter to the President of Ford and tell him his marketing department sucks.

[hybridbear]

This is how Ford should be marketing the Fusion & its advanced driver assistance technologies!

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1093086_drivers-leap-from-moving-cars-to-test-hyundai-genesis-safety-system-video

 

http://youtu.be/EPTIXldrq3Q

[md13ffhguy]

Until your average gas-powered car driver can get 47 (or 43) driving a hybrid the SAME EXACT way they drive their gas-powered car, it's not worth any manufacturer's effort to push hybrids. Getting 47 in my FFH requires a COMPROMISE that I was AWARE OF BEFOREHAND and WILLING to make. Most buyers, I'm afraid, are not. They want more and more... i.e., more power and more MPGs. That's why EcoBoost sells. Advertising the FFH without a disclaimer mentioning the required compromises in order to achieve the rated MPG, would likely cause a bigger problem for Ford.

Edited July 9, 2014 by md13ffhguy