Figuring out my first hybrid

[wiscy67]

Eric,

 

Thanks for trying different options to improve mileage and sharing the results. As a new FFH '14 owner I've been reading these forums and trying different techniques. Since my 27 mile each way commute comprises most of my driving miles I feel this is a pretty controlled environment for experimenting. For me some of the things that make mileage worse (cold weather, uphills, high speeds/acceleration, auto climate control, reduced EV mode miles, ICE mode without charging HVB, dirty exterior).

 

In addition to making my daily commute and trying different styles I also experiment with my city driving to see which route makes for better mileage. In doing this I determined that a new way from my house to the local swim/racquet club is shorter and gets me around 70 mpg going and 53 mpg returning.

[hybridbear]

I bought the service information as I did for my last car. I got an OBDLink MX Blutooth scan tool, but have only used it on my old Fusion with the Forscan software. The Forscan software is neat as it shows many of the Ford PIDs on my old Fusion. I hope it will show some of the interesting Ford PIDs listed in the service information for the new car. The new Fusion has a lot of modules!

Thanks all for your comments so far.

Regards, Eric

FORScan is great! You can get access to tons of great information. There are a few threads on the Energi Forum of the great data you can access. It doesn't all apply to the FFH, but most of it does. Here are links to some threads you may enjoy reading if you haven't already that talk about the data you can access and interpreting it. Some of the data may be outdated because our understanding has improved over time, but most of it should be current. I'm posting the most current threads first.

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/9689-road-trip-observations-with-torque-pro/

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/8011-understanding-the-power-flow-screens/

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/8416-fusion-hybrid-powertrain-technical-analysis-with-torque-pro-a-scangauge/

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/7492-understanding-the-ffh-better-with-a-scangauge/

 

If you like understanding the components of the car, check out this thread:

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/9602-ffh-factoids-parts-quiz/

 

Please add your observations and interpretations as you learn more about how the car operates. :)

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

Thanks, very interesting intensely informative threads.

The discussions seems to indicate that even if I got a Fusion Energi, I would still be using the ICE during the highway portion of my commute. With the Hybrid I am seeing numbers around 11 miles for EV and 1 mile Regen for a 17.8 mile commute one way. I suppose the advantage with the Energi is up to 22 EV miles are provided by the grid instead of fuel, but my calculations indicated not much savings.

I realize even though I get an instantaneous MPG in the 20s with the ICE on, that it is charging the battery for later EV usage. I see that mentioned in comments with a MPGe effectively in the 40s, which I get over time by using EV mode later on.

I did the second fueling at 920 Total Miles this morning, with 44.4 MPG indicated/42.4 calculated. The difference represents about one half gallon of fuel. This is up from 40.9 MPG indicated/40.4 calculated, using an estimated mileage for the dealer fueling. I am now seeing improved trip MPGs in the upper 40s and lower 50s. This is due to both higher outdoor temperatures and better driving technique.

I have been reading about how OBD2 and Mode 22 diagnostic commands work. The device connected to the OBD2 plug actively requests the data. In 2005 I read about a guy who used a netbook to get additional information from the Prius through the OBD2 connector.

When I got my 2006 Fusion, I got a Canbus USB dongle, OBD2 plug, and wired it up. I used simple software that just dumped the data from the Canbus, so it was a passive network sniffer. It was interesting to see the various pieces of information exchanged between the modules. I was surprised to see the vehicle's VIN transmitted every couple of seconds. I was able to figure out some of the data.

I would like to try the same passive sniffing with the 2015. It may be possible to correlate the OBD2/Mode 22 data with the internal networking messages to figure out the internal message data. The advantage with passive monitoring is you can get information without additional network/module loading.

The tools have improved since 2006. Wireshark is a neat program used for Ethernet network protocol analysis. I may get a PICAN board and setup one of my Raspberry PIs.
http://skpang.co.uk/blog/archives/1141

So many projects, so little time! Maybe a summertime project.

 

I did hook up my OBDLink MX to the 2015 and briefly tried out Forscan and Torque Lite. Now that I know that Torque Lite works, I am going to buy the Pro version and setup the Extended PIDs.

Regards Eric

[Hybrider]

I also see instantenous MPG in the 20's when in ICE mode, even when I'm getting average trip MPGs in the 50s, 60's, and even 70's. During these same high MPG trips, my SOC usually fluctuates at quite a low value, usually between 1/3 and less than 1/2 on the battery-fullness gauge.

 

That is one indicator to me that my MPG averages might be going irreparably down, in other words I may not be driving as efficiently as possible, is when I see the battery gauge getting above 3/4 SOC, letting me quickly know that I may want to let off on the accelerator to force a switch back to EV mode, since the continued ICE mode could be due to just the slightest increasing elevation causing the ICE to stay on.

 

So basically, I don't worry about how long I stay in EV, or how full I can get my battery, or what my instaneous MPG indicator says. I prefer to worry about how long my ICE, not EV, is on for any single length of time.

 

So as a whole, I just try to minimize the total energy spent accelerating and the energy losses due to braking, and let the indicators do what they may.

Edited April 1, 2015 by Hybrider

[Easy Rider]

I suppose the advantage with the Energi is up to 22 EV miles are provided by the grid instead of fuel, but my calculations indicated not much savings.

 

 

The plug-in hybrids shine for people who make a lot of round trips that are under the EV threshold; thus using NO gas.

A mild climate helps with that.

Living in an area where electricity is relatively cheap helps with the "miles per dollar" calculation too.

 

My guess is that if your trips are often more than 4X the pure EV range, the savings are pretty meger.

 

If (when) gas goes back up to $4 a gallon, that will make it more attractive too.

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

I have reached the 1K Mile mark! The temperatures were in the 50s yesterday with 60s today. I am seeing Trip MPGs improve to the mid 50 MPG range, with a high of 60.3 MPG.

I bought Torque Pro and got it partially setup. I noticed the coolant temperature when I left work was in the mid 60s or about 8 degrees above ambient. This morning the coolant temperature was at ambient in the mid 50s and I got EV mode right away with delayed ICE warmup. This may explain why I was getting ICE warmup right away on cold day work commutes, but delayed ICE warmup on cold day home commutes. The coolant temperature was above a certain level on the start of the home commute. It is suppose to be back in the 30s next week so I can test it.

I have around 9 miles of highway with about 60% at 55 MPH speed limit and the rest at 40/45 MPH. Today's commute had heavy traffic, so it was more stop and go. It is interesting to graph out the commute.

I look more to the Fuel History, set to six minute intervals, rather than instantaneous MPG, to get an idea of how I am doing. I know the first six minutes in the morning are going to be "bad" due to ICE warmup. It appears I can get things warmed up quicker by accelerating at 1-1/2 to 2 Bars on the Empower gauge, since the ICE is running anyway.

My current strategy is to have the car in EV mode at 1 Bar and less, ICE at 1-1/2 Bars and more, and mostly limit acceleration to 2 Bars. This results in periods with the ICE on, but the 6 minute average can still be over 50 MPG. The car will automatically follow this strategy most of the time.

I find sometimes I have slightly too much pressure on the accelerator and have to back off a little to get the car into EV mode. I had similar situations in my 2006 Fusion. I would back off slightly on the accelerator, the car would upshift, the engine RPM would drop, and the car would sometimes speed up slightly. I can recognize this state in my 2006 Fusion by the engine sound and the vehicle speed.

Regards, Eric

[Easy Rider]

My current strategy is

 

I think that most "strategies" that are practical on a public road are mostly a waste of time and attention.

 

With a non-plugin hybrid, 100% of the energy used to power the car down the highway comes from........gas burned in the engine.

If and when you are able to finesse it into going into EV mode, the energy used will just be replaced into the battery later.

That "later" might end up being a time when it is not really efficient to do that.

 

But if you enjoy this kind of a "game", by all means continue.

Just try not to compromise safety while attempting to squeeze out an extra tenth of a mile per gallon.

 

Just having a light foot on the accelerator and anticipating traffic ahead to minimize stops is most of the battle.

[mwr]

I think that most "strategies" that are practical on a public road are mostly a waste of time and attention.

 

With a non-plugin hybrid, 100% of the energy used to power the car down the highway comes from........gas burned in the engine.

If and when you are able to finesse it into going into EV mode, the energy used will just be replaced into the battery later.

That "later" might end up being a time when it is not really efficient to do that.

 

But if you enjoy this kind of a "game", by all means continue.

Just try not to compromise safety while attempting to squeeze out an extra tenth of a mile per gallon.

 

Just having a light foot on the accelerator and anticipating traffic ahead to minimize stops is most of the battle.

I couldn't agree more. As you can see, I removed myself from fuelly because (1) I found I was a bit OCD about filling up at the same gas pump, etc, and (2) I'm very satisfied withe the mpg I'm getting and see no reason to spend time and attention on what it exactly turns out to be. Seeing the displayed mpg and subtracting 2 mpg does it for me. Now I just sit back and enjoy the ride, with very liberal use of CC..

[lolder]

I only subtract 1 mpg because the odometer reads about 2.5% low in the 2010-12s. I believe the 2013+ may be the same.

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

My strategy is what the car is doing anyway, but sometimes it seems to get stuck in an inefficent state. So it is just recognizing the inefficent state and correcting it, if possible. A light foot on the accelerator and anticipating traffic ahead to minimize stops is a strategy I have followed for years. That is what love about the hybrid. The ICE stops when I coast to a red light and stays off until I go. If traffic is crawling then the car uses more efficient battery power.

The plug-in hybrid just provides a cheaper source of electic power and increases the inital SoC of the battery. The battery has energy stored at two different costs. It makes sense for the Energi to use the battery more since running the ICE could max out the SoC and waste fuel by not charging the battery. This does not totally go away in the Hybrid. In the extreme case of the driver causing the ICE to run all the time, there comes a point where the SoC is at maximum and fuel economy suffers because energy is not stored in the battery. In the other extreme case of causing the EV mode to occur all the time, you eventually run out of battery and the ICE will run, even when it is not efficent.

I am pleased with the Fuel Economy, but curious about how well the car will do in the warmer weather. A 2 MPG difference between indicated and calculated fuel economy after a recent fillup amounted to about one half gallon of fuel, or about $1.20. The 10+ MPG increase I am seeing with warmer weather is more significant. It means I could commute 3 more days before needing to refuel.

I am interested in how the Hybrid works. I find the logging function of Toque Pro a great feature since I can just drive and figure things out later.

Regards Eric

[md13ffhguy]

I couldn't agree more. As you can see, I removed myself from fuelly because (1) I found I was a bit OCD about filling up at the same gas pump, etc, and (2) I'm very satisfied withe the mpg I'm getting and see no reason to spend time and attention on what it exactly turns out to be. Seeing the displayed mpg and subtracting 2 mpg does it for me. Now I just sit back and enjoy the ride, with very liberal use of CC..

I use Fuelly and I've learned to disregard where the gauge is after I fill up. A little above or below F? I don't care anymore - I just record the gallons pumped. I don't care about which pump at which station, or how many clicks I can squeeze in after the first. There's more value in the aggregate numbers anyhow. Looking at things tank by tank seems pointless. Looking at five or ten consecutive fills gives a better picture of how I've been doing. Looking at my individual tanks on a graph is like looking at the plans for a roller coaster - up one, down the next. Better to draw a nice trend line through the middle. Edited April 5, 2015 by md13ffhguy

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

I have not tried Fuelly yet. I do keep a notebook where I put in various notes about starting mileage on days I drive the car, refuelings, repair info, oil changes, and trip results. I started to also note the temperature.

The 2006 Fusion has only one MPG display that I would ocassionally reset when refuelling. I noticed the car was down four MPG a couple of years ago. I restored it by cleaning the MAF sensor and throttle body. That was about a 15% drop or about 52 mile loss of range. It took a while to notice because the MPGs would swing depending on the mix of city and highway traffic.

I can get the MPG for each commute with the 2015 FFH and it makes the readings seem more sensitive to temperature, trip time, etc..., I need to compare apples to apples. Looking over the time between refuellings, the variation is not as great. I expect to get better MPGs in the summer, and worse MPGs in the winter, but it is still way better than the 2006.

I like the compass and temperature displays in the car. I almost bought a replacement rear view mirror for the 2006 that had a compass. I think it was auto-dimming like my 2015. I did not know my 2015 had an auto-dimming mirror.

I am disappointed that the navigation map display does not have more scale selections. It also found the voice too loud and had to really turn down the volume in the settings to have any effect. It did not seem like it was getting softer as the voice was saying "softer". The traffic feature does not seem alert the driver as my Garmin. If you say traffic while on a route, the display is nearby traffic, and not traffic along the route. I need to check to see if there is a command for traffic along the route. Otherwise I am really happy with the car.

Regards Eric

[wiscy67]

Eric,

 

I would second the desire to receive advance traffic alerts and a prompt for a re-route away from that traffic. My Garmin in my last car did just that. Perhaps I haven't figured out how to use the FFH NAV optimally yet.

 

Fuelly is a great logging tool that allows me to look back at mileage results but it also calculates fuel costs including costs per mile.

 

I use an after market mirror with auto dimming on my FFH that provides the homelink capabilities since I did not want a moon roof even if it were free.

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

I decided to just drive my style and the MPGs are still improving with the warmer temperatures. I can now get into the 50s, and barely got over 60 on a couple trips. It looks like this tankful will go further than the last one.

It is interesting to compare my Fusion to the Priuses (or is it Pri?) several of my coworkers drive. One coworker wondered how fast the Prius would go in EV mode on a drive to lunch and pressed the EV button. The Prius cancelled the EV mode at about 15 MPH or so. The coworker tends to keep the car in Eco mode.

I used the Forscan software on my 2006 Fusion. I have an OBDScan MX so Forscan can access the Ford MS-CAN bus on the DLC. There are all kinds of interesting parameters you can look at when using the program. It is neat being about to press a button on the steering wheel and have it show up on the display in Forscan.

I noticed Forscan did not list many modules for my 2015 FFH. The ABS module was missing. The reason is Ford replaced the MS-CAN bus with a second HS-CAN bus on the DLC. The ABS module is on this second HS-CAN bus.

I did an experiment using a terminal program to talk to the OBDScan MX. I was able to select the MS-CAN mode preset, increase the baudrate to the HS-CAN rate, and see data on the HS2-CAN bus. I gave the details to the Forscan developers and I am helping them add support for HS2-CAN. Hopefully there will be an update soon that supports the FFH better.

I am glad that I got the Ford Service Information, even though I do not intend to do my own repairs. The 2015 Service Information explains the different modules better than the 2006 Service Information. The 2015 FFH has three separate HS-CAN buses and one MS-CAN bus. There is a gateway module that allows modules on one bus to talk to modules on another bus, and allows a diagnostic tool connected to the DLC to access the third HS-CAN bus and the MS-CAN bus. Embedded Device Communications is part of my day job, so I am interested in how the system works. The 2015 Service Information also lists the CAN messages exchanged between modules, although it does not list the ids.

Regards Eric

[lolder]

Huh?

[GrySql]

Huh?

He means this: :headspin:

Edited April 10, 2015 by GrySql

[lolder]

Oh.

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

Cars use modules and buses to reduce the amount of wiring in the car, although there is still alot of wiring. Ford needs to light up the charge ring on the Energi? Just put in a GFM and plug in the bus and light connections. The GFM module reads messages from other modules via the bus connection to determine how to light the charge ring. Ford can use the same module on multiple PHEV vehicles.

I had my best trip MPG today. :) The temperatures were in the 50s today and I also got good highway MPGs as well. I am just driving normally.

Regards Eric

[Eric.C.Boston]

Hello,

The recent warmer weather allowed me to move more stuff over to the new car and I finally played with the moon roof. I like the moon roof. I still have not totally setup the car, but I am not in any rush. I really like the side pockets in the door. They seem bigger than the 2006 and have a little cubbyhole. The ambient lighting helps me see what is in there. A big Maglite under the 2006 driver's seat was moved to the glove compartment. The shelf is great. There is more room on top of the dash compared to the 2006. The 2006 did have this neat compartment in the top center of the dash that was great for storing a thin GPS and receipts. The larger glove compartment on the 2015 somewhat makes up for it. I suppose I could use the door cubyhole and items would be mostly out-of-sight. I did not really use the door drink holders on the 2006.

I am still learning about the car. I was wondering why only the ambient lights came on when I open the door, and found I had switched off the overhead lights! I need another session sitting in the vehicle with the owner's manual. I did not think I would like or use the ambient lights, but they are useful.

I managed to break the new car already! A light dome in the console storage bin got pushed in. I need to use a plastic opening tool to pop out the media center panel and put the light dome back in place. The cord notch on the console is a nice touch as I usually crunched the cord using the console DC power plug in the 2006.

The new car uses an IA key. It seems like using a physical key is now considered unusual, as a cover has to be removed to access the key cylinder. The physical key is considered an emergency backup. I wondered what the small bin at the bottom of the console storage bin was, and the manual indicates you put the key there for certain functions. I got 2 IA keys and a Valet key. The Valet key has no remote. There is a valet mode mentioned in the MFT settings, but no description of the Valet key. I should try it and see what happens. I assume I have to put it in the small bin. I wonder if it will unlock the door without putting it in the key cylinder.

The last two home commutes were 59.9 MPG and 60.0 MPG. The home commute still gets better mileage than the work commute. I suspect ICE warmup, while stopped at one of the two lights near my house, is the cause. I am interested to see if the warmup decreases when the overnight temperature gets into the 50s and 60s.

The calculated MPG is going up when I refuel. I was surprised to see the Miles to Empty at 640 Miles. I tend to refuel when it gets below 50. Maybe I will run it down to zero next time. I had a trip planned, so I needed to refuel. The lifetime MPG is creeping up as well. Maybe I can make the 600 Club soon! I was so close!

Date Total Trip Gallon Calc MPG
March 9 9.2 0 -- ----- Dealer Refuel (Estimated)
March 20 440.8 431.6 10.686 40.39
April 1 920.3 479.4 11.319 42.35
April 14 1443.2 522.9 10.862 48.14

Regards Eric

Edited April 15, 2015 by Eric.C.Boston

[murphy]

It's not a valet key. In my 2013 it is used to lock the glove box. Enable valet mode in the center screen and hand an IA key to the valet.

 

The bin's main use is to start the car if the battery in the IA key is dead. Put the IA key in the bin with the key ring loop up and the buttons facing the back of the car.

[Eric.C.Boston]

It's not a valet key. In my 2013 it is used to lock the glove box. Enable valet mode in the center screen and hand an IA key to the valet.

 

The bin's main use is to start the car if the battery in the IA key is dead. Put the IA key in the bin with the key ring loop up and the buttons facing the back of the car.

Hello,

 

Thanks. I only got two keys with the 2006 and the glove compartment does not have a lock. I thought car makers eliminated the lock as it is really simple to break in. The 2015 glove compartment door is more substantial than the 2006 one, but someone could still break in. I put the glove box key on my house keyring so I do not have to dig the physical key out of the IA key to access the door key cylinder.

 

I had a 'Doh! moment when using the navigation last night. I thought the maps only had 3 zoom levels and auto. I should of realized that they are presets. Now I can adjust the zoom level to make the map more useful for my commute.

 

The new car is complex so I expect to be discovering "new" features for a couple of more months.

 

Regards Eric