Cross Traffic System Fault

[fpliptak]

Well, I just got a call from the Service Advisor. After discussions with the Service Manager they are going "to start the paperwork to get a Ford Rep to get involved". This apparently takes a while to get to the point where it actually happens and considering Monday is a national holiday I don't see anything happening other than feet dragging.

 

I spoke with Ford Customer Care after the last visit and was told that the case had been elevated to the Regional Rep. I must be missing something. How far up the chain does it have to go before someone from the Ford Customer Care team really evaluates the car and the process. I realize that what happened today won't get to the Customer Care team until later but I feel that as soon as the car showed the fault yesterday morning the ball should have started rolling.

 

So here is the updated timeline

 

Date Mileage Comment

01/03/2015 11,565.2 Cross Traffic System Fault

01/17/2015 11,672.3 Cross Traffic System Fault

01/31/2015 11,877.1 Cross Traffic System Fault

02/14/2014 12,043.5 Cross Traffic System Fault

02/19/2015 - 03/10/2015 Car at dealership for CTS Fault -DS7Z14C689C Sensor Assembly replaced

03/14/2015 12,456.6 Cross Traffic Fault

03/21/2015 - 04/11/2015 Car at dealership for CTS Fault - Can't reproduce problem

Picked up car and "Wrench" light on - left at dealership for diagnose/repair

DS7Z18D473A Pump Assembly replaced

04/25/2015 13,170.9 Cross Traffic System Fault

05/09/2015 13,811.4 Cross Traffic System Fault - Other dealership found codes 310 & P1176

05/20/2015 - 05/22/2015 Car at dealership to replace sensors

Sensors replaced and taken for test drive - after 7 miles the CTS Fault occurred

Dealership to start paperwork to get Ford Rep involved

 

 

Am I missing something?

[GrySql]

Am I missing something?

Start at page 228 in your 2013 FFH Owner's Manual, lots of good info there.

[fpliptak]

GrySql, are you referring to the Better Business Bureau (BBB) Auto Line Program? I have the 3rd printing (pdf version) of the standard 2013 Ford Fusion Owners Manual, there does not seem to be a separate version for the Energi (which is what I actually have).

 

I will keep this in mind as we progress with the Ford Rep.

 

As a side note the reason I have this listed in the Hybrid forum is because there was already a thread here addressing problems with the CTS.

[acdii]

Well a couple things to note, this is not a drivability issue, so a lemon law may be difficult. Second to note, intermittent issues like this are very difficult to resolve. You can keep persueing Ford to get it fixed, or do like I did and just get rid of it. I have been down this path with the first one, and it was a nightmare, wish I had the issue you have, at least you got some codes to work with.

 

The problems I had with the second one were very minor, and only I noticed them because I was in tune with the car, and since no codes, it would be even more difficult to track down once they figured out just what my complaint was, so I just came to the point, wasn't worth my time. I did not get rid of my second car due to the problem, but because it was too painful to drive, I could barely walk after an hour in the car, so I had to replace it with something I could drive, otherwise I would still have it.

 

Unless the car stops working, has to be towed, has left you stranded, then you have a long uphill battle with Ford. I have been through this, so good luck.

[fpliptak]

Well the car spent Thursday and Friday (June 4th and 5th) at the dealership. The Ford Tech Service Representative was there to determine what the next step should be. I'm not sure what the final decision was but the car was sent home on Friday with the possibility that the wiring harness is going to be replaced. The other option that has been discussed was to change both rear cross traffic sensors.

 

So for now it is back to wait and see what the decision will be.

[fpliptak]

Got a call today (06/11/15) from the Ford dealer Service Advisor. The decision has been made to change the wiring harness and has been scheduled for July 2nd 2015. I assume we are waiting for the part(s) and possibly for the Tech Rep to be on-site for the switch out.

 

Wish me luck. I think we will need it.

 

In the words of the Greatful Dead - "What a long strange trip it's been"

[fpliptak]

Well, the dealer picked up the car at 10:00 A.M. on July 2nd (yesterday). As of now (Friday July 3rd at 11:00 P.M.) I have not heard anything. It may have something to do with the 4th of July holiday but it would have been nice to at least got an update. Does anyone know how long it takes to change out the wiring harness?

[cjn-md]

Hi, fpliptak. I had all my harnesses replaced in my 2014 Fusion interestingly it was also an Ice Storm as yours looks to be.

The main body harness the one inside the car to the rear sensors took several days as the interior of the car has to come out. The engine harness took about a week.

If they are replacing the BCM be sure the shop has the latest software. Al Packer's in Maryland toasted 2 BCM's in my car before figuring this out. If the BCM is dead the whole car is one big door stop.

I wish you the best getting this fixed but the Cross traffic system communicates on all networks so it could be any or all of the harnesses or worse yet even a noisy male to female connector anywhere in the system that causes the fault.

[fpliptak]

cjn-md, Thanks for the time line on the replacement. Sounds like it will be out of commission for at least a week. So far the car has spent 52 days in the shop this year. I can only hope the dealer has the latest software for the BCM or the Ford Rep has advised them that is I necessary.

 

By the way the car color is Ice Storm. My wife originally ordered Ginger Ale but by the time the order was placed (dispute between Ford and the dealership about Electric Certified) Ginger Ale had been "color balanced out".

 

Well, again we are back to the waiting game.

 

I will post any updates as soon as I receive them.

[fpliptak]

Well the dealer completed the repairs and everything seems to be OK. My wife (the primary driver) is now less confident in the car due to the problems and it will take some time to recover from the "trauma".

 

We did take it on a longer drive than our normal bi-weekly trip to the dog groomer's and had no issues. Hopefully this means that the problem has been solved.

 

Only time will tell.

[fpliptak]

Well, the problem is back. This past Saturday we took our bi-weekly drive to the coast and it was the first cold weekend (~35 deg F in the morning). After about 20 miles of highway driving the Cross Traffic Alert Fault came on again. Same Left Rear Sensor shows the fault. I called the dealer and said I was going to take the car to the closest open Ford dealer with a service department open on Saturday to get the codes. The codes listed were U3000 and U0253. Spoke with my dealer and he will contact the Ford Hot-Line. My frustration level is increasing. This has to have something to do with temperature.

 

HELP !!!!!!

[hybridbear]

Well, the problem is back. This past Saturday we took our bi-weekly drive to the coast and it was the first cold weekend (~35 deg F in the morning). After about 20 miles of highway driving the Cross Traffic Alert Fault came on again. Same Left Rear Sensor shows the fault. I called the dealer and said I was going to take the car to the closest open Ford dealer with a service department open on Saturday to get the codes. The codes listed were U3000 and U0253. Spoke with my dealer and he will contact the Ford Hot-Line. My frustration level is increasing. This has to have something to do with temperature.

 

HELP !!!!!!

What's the code after the U3000? It should be U3000:xx. There are a variety of issues identified by that code, determined by the 2 characters following the colon.

Some options indicate an issue with the Side Obstacle Detection Control Module, this would seem to fit the issue you're having. The dealer can perform a pinpoint test to see which side is the issue. Your info says it's the left side, but the dealer has a process to confirm that. The Workshop Manual tells the dealer to replace the SODL in that case. Has this already been done on your car?

 

I was not able to find U0253. Perhaps GrySql can...

[GrySql]

I was not able to find U0253. Perhaps GrySql can...

Found this in the Information and Entertainment System section.

 

U0253:00

Lost Communication With Accessory Protocol Interface Module (APIM): No Sub Type Information

 

This DTC discusses all the Modules in that section, ACM, APIM, FCDIM, FCIM.

It suggests checking all the Module's for failure and all connectors for proper contact .

It also suggests reviewing all TSB's regarding the Entertainment system.

 

--

BTW, Post #108 above mentions replacing wiring harnesses, this may be that type of problem.

Edited October 27, 2015 by GrySql

[fpliptak]

Re hybridbear: The service tech from the dealer I visited only gave me the U3000 and U0253 with no other information. He also said that he could not run the full diagnostics on the car (the senior tech would be in on Monday).

 

Re: GrySql: The wiring harness was replaced in July and seemed to solve the problem but I am now feeling that the problem is temperature related. Also of note is that as the average temperature increased last spring it took longer and longer for the failure to occur. I would hate to think that we have to replace the wiring harness again.

 

The car is scheduled to visit the dealership on Thursday (10/29/2015) for three (3) recalls and they know that the CTA Fault is back. They were supposed to contact the Ford Hot-Line on Monday to get guidance on how to proceed.

 

Somewhere there must be a solution to this problem.

[fpliptak]

Sorry, I forgot to mention that the side sensor had been replaced prior to the wiring harness being replaced.

 

Is that the SODL?

[Texasota]

These types of problems are very frustrating. Technology is great when it works but infuriating when it fails. Unfortunately, this is only a small taste of the kinds of problems that we will encounter with self driving cars.

[GrySql]

Sorry, I forgot to mention that the side sensor had been replaced prior to the wiring harness being replaced.

 

Is that the SODL?

SODL, Side Obstacle Detection control module, Left side. The SODR is the Right side.

 

I mentioned the harness because this U0253:00 DTC is for the Entertainment module, maybe it was not connected properly. Temperature expansion/contraction causing a fault may point to a bad connection somewhere too. (Edit: Or a cracked circuit board or solder joint in any of the on-board modules.)

 

I hope they get it right this time!

Edited October 27, 2015 by GrySql

[cjn-md]

I feel your pain. This issue crosses many systems in the vehicle so it is difficult to get a grip on the root cause.
My car still had the issue after all the major wiring harnesses (interior and engine) along with the sensors were replaced.

You really need to have a FORD field engineer requested to come out and look at the car along with the local staff.
Based on personal experience ​this issue is beyond the skill set of the local shops technicians.

 

By the way mine was an Ice Storm as well. Hmm?

Edited October 28, 2015 by cjn-md

[FordService]

Well, the problem is back. This past Saturday we took our bi-weekly drive to the coast and it was the first cold weekend (~35 deg F in the morning). After about 20 miles of highway driving the Cross Traffic Alert Fault came on again. Same Left Rear Sensor shows the fault. I called the dealer and said I was going to take the car to the closest open Ford dealer with a service department open on Saturday to get the codes. The codes listed were U3000 and U0253. Spoke with my dealer and he will contact the Ford Hot-Line. My frustration level is increasing. This has to have something to do with temperature.

 

HELP !!!!!!

 

I want to get this checked out. Please PM me your VIN, mileage, best daytime phone number, full name, and dealer name/location.

 

Meagan

[BoatDrinksQ5]

Seems like at first glance that it is a fairly tough thing to figure out (very intermittent), dealing with codes, however at least a few had this occur (now in the hands of Ford hopefully).... with hundreds of hours of 'tech' time invested by Ford (even before "Lemon'd"). SHould have been able to quickly root this problem out and turn it into Lemonade for future issues.

 

As an engineer and control tech/programmer... I CANNOT believe that the systems controls and programming can't be monitored by an on-board laptop (or phone via Bluetooth), and trend log sensor readings and resulting software and controller outputs.... which then can be monitored by Ford techs or sent to Ford QC. If not.... what year is it????

 

These posts here can not be the only cases of this occurring - in addition similar systems are used in their other cars/brands.

Edited October 28, 2015 by BoatDrinksQ5

[cjn-md]

BoatDrinksQ5, you would think this to be the case. That Ford would recapture these cars and send them in for technical evaluation. Specially in a unique case such as this where the problem is documented to re-occur and multiple corrective actions are not effective. My service writer got tired of seeing my photos of the error message with the new mileage at each event. He could not push back on me even if the technicians could not find a code.

In the case of my 2013 Fusion buyback I do not think this vehicle made to back to Ford's technical team for further evaluation..
I followed the VIN number online by checking CarFax to see it movement and where it would end up.

It was quickly transfered out of MD to a GA Ford dealer where is sat on the lot deeply discounted for months since they were still selling the 2013's at the time.

 

​

[fpliptak]

Well the car went to the shop yesterday and I was contacted today by the Senior Regional Customer Service Manager (Thanks Meagan for the Case number and the elevation). I spoke with the SRCSM and we discussed the number of trips to the dealership and the length of the stays (60 days in the shop between February and July). He was not aware that at least one of the wiring harnesses had been replaced. The dealership will be in getting some assistance in diagnosing the issue (sometime Monday).

 

So, for now, the car sits in the shop. If that is what it takes to get a final resolution of the problem I can live with that. It is much better than worrying / wondering when it will happen again.

 

I still have the feeling that it is related to the ambient temperature.

 

Again, thanks to Meagan for raising the visibility of my problem.

 

I will try to keep this thread updated with the progress.

 

Also, I appreciate the hints, suggestions and support I have been given in this forum; a great group of people!

[FordService]

Well the car went to the shop yesterday and I was contacted today by the Senior Regional Customer Service Manager (Thanks Meagan for the Case number and the elevation)...

 

Thanks for the update, fpliptak! I'm Crystal, and I'll be helping out here while Meagan is out of the office. If you need any additional assistance, don't hesitate to give me a shout. :)

 

Crystal

[fpliptak]

Well the car has been at the dealership for 8 full days and the only thing I have heard from the dealership is that they are working with the Ford engineers but no details. According to the MyFordMobile site it has just been sitting there and has not been communicating since early last evening. The really frustrating part is not being updated.

 

I spoke with the Customer Service Rep last Friday and forwarded the information about the history and he was going to compare what I had with what the dealership had provided. The interesting part was that he did not know about the wiring harness being replaced in July. Strange that the dealership never billed Ford for the repair.

 

Still waiting for answers.

[fpliptak]

HELP!!!!!!!

 

Well today I got an e-mail from the Ford Regional Customer Service Manager stating that the dealership was going to be working with their Ford Field Service Engineer. The FFSE should be reaching out to the dealership and helping them with a repair direction

 

The car has been at the dealership for two weeks and the dealership has supposedly been in contact with the Ford Technical Hotline but they have not been able to duplicate the concern but suspect water intrusion and the local technician was supposed to test for chafing and water intrusion on the 6th. Five days later there is no word on what happened with that testing.

 

I have not been able to communicate with the car (via the MyFordMobile app and website) for seven days.

 

The question is now "Is the car in pieces on the shop floor or is it sitting out on the lot collecting dust?"

 

Crystal / Meagan: Where do we go from here? I am getting more frustrated every day.

 

The car has been in the shop now for 73 days out of the last 265 days (since February 19th, 2015). That is 27.5% of the time in the shop.

 

I have made 2 1/2 car payments for a car that sits at the dealership and nothing seems to be getting done.

 

 

HELP