Preparing for winter with a comprehensive strategy to improve MPGs including grille blocking & more

[Wingmn]

I'm interested - but I would caution - that you get more than just two of us interested - for me - the time it woud take me to get one made myself would just take probably a whole day, first I'd have to source the material, don't know how long that would take... - but if you get enough people interested, if you have the time - count me in.

[Da0ne]

count me in also taking a hit in mpg since the weather has been in the 40's

[acdii]

If I had time to make these, I would be in direct competition with you. However, I dont have the time, nor gumption to seek out liability insurance for selling something like this.

 

My understanding is, depending on the state it was sold in, the law is if you sell something to someone and it causes damage, there is liability. Considering the cost of the hybrid system should one become damaged by overheating due to having a grill cover installed, and how greedy the legal system has become, I choose not to sell my design, but made a few and gave a couple away. The savings by having one has already paid the cost of the plastic, so that's how I look at it. For the few bucks made, not worth the risk to me.

 

There is also the possibility of damaging the chrome on the grill when grit gets trapped between the cover and grill and turns into sand paper. The plastic I used is much softer than the chrome over plastic of the grill so it will take the brunt of damage. I may have some ideas to isolate the cover from the grill that I am looking into to prevent the scuffing I found on the first cover I sent to HB.

Edited October 29, 2013 by acdii

[Wingmn]

I was thinking about that - is the plastic/lexan thin enough to wrap the edges in that door sill guards you can buy? (the door edge protectors) That would protect the "fake" crome plastic from rubbing problems. Perhaps.

[Eddie Sessum]

I would love to have this on my MKZ but the ugliness of it makes me just loose MPG if it gets to that point. Is there any chance of covering the lower grill to help any? I can get something in there from the inside and all u would see is the straps.

[hybridbear]

I would love to have this on my MKZ but the ugliness of it makes me just loose MPG if it gets to that point. Is there any chance of covering the lower grill to help any? I can get something in there from the inside and all u would see is the straps.

You don't want to block the lower grille. Unless Ford drastically changed the under hood structure of the MKZh (highly unlikely) the lower grille opening is what allows air to flow across the inverter radiator. You do not want to block this except perhaps in extreme cold, as in below 0^oF sustained temps. The electronic components should be kept cool. Covering the lower grille would impede their airflow while not really blocking airflow to the ICE radiator which is the main issue in cold weather.

[KLH]

Paul, sign me up! I'll send an email too...

[Eddie Sessum]

I would have thought ford fixed the grill shutters to where they don't open until the car is completely warmed up. I know once it opens temp will drop quick but shouldn't it close again?

[hybridbear]

I would have thought ford fixed the grill shutters to where they don't open until the car is completely warmed up. I know once it opens temp will drop quick but shouldn't it close again?

The grille shutters don't do a whole lot to block airflow. Since they're behind the grille the air just bounces off them and goes around them. When you put a cover on the front of the car like ptjones is talking about or like I have that blocks the majority of the airflow that would have otherwise gone in that grille. Blocking airflow to the ICE radiator isn't much of an issue as the ICE stays very cold regardless. However, blocking airflow to the hybrid components radiator isn't a good idea as we want to keep those components as cool as possible.

[GrySql]

Flash!! This just in...... (insert breaking news story music here)

 

 

Secret spy photo of Hybridbears new grille warmer and comprehensive winter MPG plan.

 

Now we know.... :camera:

 

[corncobs]

Awesome!!!

[GrySql]

I won't be making a living with Photoshop, that's for sure.....

[hybridbear]

The coolant can drop as low as 60^oC (140^oF) before the HVAC will make the ICE idle to create heat. This is better than it was last winter before the PCM update. Before the PCM update the coolant temp only had to drop to 65^oC (149^oF) before the ICE would idle to make heat.

 

This is also greatly inferior to what Toyota has programmed into the Prius. The Prius ICE will come on at 145^oF to make heat normally, but will go as cold as 114^oF when in Eco mode without making the ICE run to make heat.

[acdii]

Prius also has a thermos bottle to store hot coolant, so it can go colder than the Fusion. I have noticed that at 19* EV is much harder to reach than above 30, but the instant MPG is a LOT higher, at least in this one compared to BD, whether or not the update has anything to do with that I dont know, or care, all I know for sure is that this car does exactly what I expect out of it, and I am very pleased with it.

 

Damn its been cold these past few days already, 19* both yesterday and this morning, but still managed to get mid 40's, where that other thing was lucky to get 34. I feel like Tigger on happy pills and a new spring tail.

 

Now if I can only figure out what I am doing wrong on the way home to get crappy mileage, I will be even happier, must be the double amount of traffic and many lights that are always red that are normally green on the way in. need more coffee

[Riggo]

Are you getting the mid 40s with your heat on acdii? It's been cold here the last two days and I've had a hard time, getting 35-39 mpg. I even tried driving the entire way home from work today with only my seat heater on and no heat. Got 42 mpg. Normally if get about 47 on that trip in the fall/spring. Maybe it's the winter fuel and using the heat combo that's getting me the upper 30 mg readings. A pretty big drop though for me.

[jsolan]

I can see where the grill cover would help immensely in the winter, the ICE seems to cool VERY quickly when you get out in the cold air.

I'm down to 42-43 on my work commute (was 50+ in the summer). I thought it would drop even more as it gets colder, but now I'm not sure. I've found the heater doesn't matter much unless you're stopped. At least in my car, the engine runs pretty constant anyway for about the first 3-5 miles regardless of whether or not I have the heater turned on. Even when it goes into EV mode after that, the threshold is much lower to kick back over to ICE until the car is fully warmed, which seems to be close to 10 miles in (about 3/4 of my trip). Once the ICE is warm, the heater blows enough warm air for me to coincide with when it needs to recharge the battery. If I'm at a stop sign, the car will shutoff as long as it's after it's initial warmup stage and I don't have the heater on.

 

Yesterday I tried pulsing and gliding on the back road for the final few miles of my trip in the morning. The past few mornings I was showing 33-34 mpg on the instant for the drive in, and yesterday I got 38.5 even though it was the coldest day of the week so far. I'm going to try to keep doing that so long as theres no traffic.

[acdii]

Are you getting the mid 40s with your heat on acdii? It's been cold here the last two days and I've had a hard time, getting 35-39 mpg. I even tried driving the entire way home from work today with only my seat heater on and no heat. Got 42 mpg. Normally if get about 47 on that trip in the fall/spring. Maybe it's the winter fuel and using the heat combo that's getting me the upper 30 mg readings. A pretty big drop though for me.

Yep, I have mine set to floor @ 72*, fan at the second speed mark. Got 44.3 this morning, I also had both seat heaters on. If I have to use defrost though, then it is lower because of the AC use.

[acdii]

I can see where the grill cover would help immensely in the winter, the ICE seems to cool VERY quickly when you get out in the cold air.

I'm down to 42-43 on my work commute (was 50+ in the summer). I thought it would drop even more as it gets colder, but now I'm not sure. I've found the heater doesn't matter much unless you're stopped. At least in my car, the engine runs pretty constant anyway for about the first 3-5 miles regardless of whether or not I have the heater turned on. Even when it goes into EV mode after that, the threshold is much lower to kick back over to ICE until the car is fully warmed, which seems to be close to 10 miles in (about 3/4 of my trip). Once the ICE is warm, the heater blows enough warm air for me to coincide with when it needs to recharge the battery. If I'm at a stop sign, the car will shutoff as long as it's after it's initial warmup stage and I don't have the heater on.

 

Yesterday I tried pulsing and gliding on the back road for the final few miles of my trip in the morning. The past few mornings I was showing 33-34 mpg on the instant for the drive in, and yesterday I got 38.5 even though it was the coldest day of the week so far. I'm going to try to keep doing that so long as theres no traffic.

With the cover i made, it acts no different now in 20* temps than it did when it was 70*. Right now the only factor that is killing the MPG is the fuel. I am using a bit less EV too due to the cold affecting the SOC, but the one thing for sure is the winter blend fuel, it makes a 3-5 MPG difference. My trips home from work have always been lower as there are more lights turning red and 3 times the traffic. Where I can do 40-45 MPH in the morning, lucky to do 35, and always having to slow down, or stop, so instead of getting around 42 or so as in the summer its more like 39. My lifetime so far has dropped from 44.1 to 43.8 just in the past two weeks since the new fuel came out mid October. My Flex has also been affected by it, normally I see 21, but this last tank was 16.8.

 

If I take off the cover, then mine will be like yours too. It makes a huge difference on this particular car, where the 2010 was hardly affected, just the fuel made the biggest difference in that car.

[aaronj1159]

I managed to hit 53 MPG on the way to work this morning in 19 degree (F) weather. This is improved from yesterday's 49 MPG in similar conditions. I did 2 things differently:

 

First, I checked my tires and found one of my back ones to be significantly lower than normal, so I fixed that.

 

Second, I only turned my heat up to 65 (and only after the car was up to temperature, as normal) instead of my normal 71. Honestly with the way I bundle up in the mornings I didn't even notice a difference.

 

I get a lot lower fuel economy on the way home due to elevation change, but yesterday I only got 39-ish. Will look to get back above 40 today for an average in the 46 range.

[hybridbear]

Prius also has a thermos bottle to store hot coolant, so it can go colder than the Fusion.

I got to see a Prius up on a lift at a Toyota dealer the other day and I saw what this looks like. It's really cool! Basically, right behind the catalytic converter there is a metal thermos bottle. The bottle is filled with coolant and the exhaust pipe runs through the middle of it. Thus the Prius stores hot coolant in that bottle to use for heat. Perhaps the FFH does something similar and we just don't know it. I really want to see the FFH up on a lift now to study it.

[acdii]

I got to see a Prius up on a lift at a Toyota dealer the other day and I saw what this looks like. It's really cool! Basically, right behind the catalytic converter there is a metal thermos bottle. The bottle is filled with coolant and the exhaust pipe runs through the middle of it. Thus the Prius stores hot coolant in that bottle to use for heat. Perhaps the FFH does something similar and we just don't know it. I really want to see the FFH up on a lift now to study it.

From what I read in the past, the Fusion does have something similar, but not as a storage device, the coolant runs around the exhaust system for faster warmup. It doesnt have capacity to maintain heat for cabin use, but is just used to bring up the over all ICE temps.

[airbusguy]

hybridbear

 

Don't know if you've followed this thread, General Info for FFH Techies

 

You might want to give a quick peek at Mounting, section 3-1 in the Body Modifiers pdf. Its the second link.

The first line is a caution about restricting airflow through the grill with sirens/lightbars - which are considerably less porous than grill shields. I realize they are probably referring to high demand requirements in hot weather, but it is interesting to note the car will automatically reduce power and torque to protect itself if airflow is impeded too much thus causing temperatures to rise too high. Make sure your covers are well hidden when you go for warranty work or even general mechanical work ;)

[Eddie Sessum]

hybridbear

 

Don't know if you've followed this thread, General Info for FFH Techies

 

You might want to give a quick peek at Mounting, section 3-1 in the Body Modifiers pdf. Its the second link.

The first line is a caution about restricting airflow through the grill with sirens/lightbars - which are considerably less porous than grill shields. I realize they are probably referring to high demand requirements in hot weather, but it is interesting to note the car will automatically reduce power and torque to protect itself if airflow is impeded too much thus causing temperatures to rise too high. Make sure your covers are well hidden when you go for warranty work or even general mechanical work ;)

 

 

Unless your doing alot of daytime desert driving at full throttle I dont see that being an issue.

[acdii]

In these cold temps, the chances of overheating are very low. The important radiator, the one for the electric components is at the bottom, and not covered. I wouldn't have one on in 80* temps though, but in winter, shouldnt be an issue at all.

[ptjones]

Well I have LEXAN sheets to make several FFH sets. I'm in the process of cutting them out and wondering how many members are interested in them. From my trip to AZ and back I have learned that the ICE update has changed the temp the shutters open until 210degrees at slow speeds and 215degrees around 60mph+. I saw temps as high as 236degrees on ScanGauge going up hills and high speed. I also have a cutout cover I use for higher temps that lowers the ICE temp by approx. 10degrees. The top white line on Smart Temp Gauge is around 242degrees. So this is not a problem but some people may not want to run coolant temp. that high so I'm going to supply second big Grill cover with cutouts to get more air flow with out losing the aero improvement. Also we need to determine where and how to attach License Plate. I'm looking at $100 for the two center covers and small lower cover.

 

Paul