Software Updates from Ford to improve MPGs

[TX NRG]

Where did you get this additional information from?

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20130716/BUSINESS0102/307160116/ford-hybrids-c-max-fusion-lincoln-mkz

[GrySql]

Don't worry, enough of us on the Forum will be the guinea pigs and report our findings.

The last sentence in that one article also got my interest:

"The automaker said it will invest $50 million to augment product development and testing with new equipment and better battery testing by the end of the year."

[TX NRG]

Isnt the Energi model rated at a lower MPG? If they increase the EV speed to 85, wont it put it in the same category?

Yes; 44City/41HWY/43combined. The Energi weighs about 300 pounds more. EPA tests don't exceed 62mph for a great length of time so EPA rating shouldn't change. The Energi also has a smaller HEV-dedicated portion of the battery compared to the FFH (1.1kwh vs 1.4kwh) which, along with the extra weight, might result in the lower mpg ratings.

[terryb]

I'll sure be keeping an eye on this thread. Note my fuelly number has dropped some more.

[aaronj1159]

If nothing else this seems like a good update for people who experience cold weather. I'm not convinced about upping the EV threshold yet, but I am excited about the other changes.

[Aquineas]

I'm a little nervous about the "lower fan speed" portion and whether that has any long-term engine reliability impact. Nevertheless I am glad Ford is addressing this, just in time for the 2014 Honda Accord Hybrid reviews (no coincidence there, I'm sure :hysterical: ). Personally I don't care if that's their motivation or not; whatever gets them into gear, I'm in favor of.

Edited July 17, 2013 by Aquineas

[acdii]

I bet they discovered what I found out last year. So maybe the engineer who looked at my car was listening. The engine always ran cold in that car. From what I make of this update, they are increasing engine temps by having the shutters closed more, lowering the fan speeds, and increasing the speed at which the engine warms up.

 

If this is in fact the case, our winter MPG will go up. One of the things I noticed is when the car was driven for long periods of time in the winter, when they road tested, they drove it for up to 4 hours, by the time they had driven it on the second trip it was fully warmed up. They were seeing acceptable(according to Ford) MPG at that point.

 

They may also have been reading the forums and taking note of those who have put grill covers on and noted the temps they were reporting and lab tested to see the results. Who knows, maybe this update will be their saving grace for the cold weather problems.

[hybridbear]

It will be interesting to see if some of the low MPG cars (MXGOLF, terryb, GrySql and others) see an improvement after this. And also if the cars that are performing well see an improvement. Hopefully this will fix the issues with the low MPG cars.

[hybridbear]

Yeah mine takes a long time to do things. It's almost worth committing a day to just sit in the waiting room so they have reason to get it done. I find when I take a loaner and go to work, they take at least a day longer than they originally plan for.

This has happened to me too. They'll tell me that they'll have it done the next day but since they give me a rental they've never been done by the time they've promised.

[aaronj1159]

This has happened to me too. They'll tell me that they'll have it done the next day but since they give me a rental they've never been done by the time they've promised.

I have a better idea as to why they think that's okay too. The guy I spoke to the 3rd time I checked up on my car (after 4 work days) said "It should be done by tomorrow evening, until then you can just keep your rental!" in a tone that made it seem like a car is a car, and you have a car to drive so no problem! Noooo, this ugly Ginger Ale Taurus with no features is not MY car, give me my car. haha.

 

Edit: I should also note that they expected me to fill the tank back up when I returned it. I filled it to the point that I would have needed to fill my Fusion and no more. I feel that is fair.

Edited July 17, 2013 by aaronj1159

[hermans]

I was at the dealer this AM for another reason and inquired about this new software update. I was told not to expect it to be available for another 4 weeks.

[LEM]

I'm a little nervous about the "lower fan speed" portion and whether that has any long-term engine reliability impact.

 

I was thinking the same thing...

[milleron]

I may be by myself here, probably am, but I am not going to rush to the dealer to have this firmware update applied immediately. As I do a high percentage of my driving on the freeway, I almost shudder to think of running along in EV mode at 70 mph, let alone 85. Eighty-five-mph EV will NOT improve performance other than on steep downgrades -- i.e., I'm pretty sure that they decided on the 62-mph cut-off on the basis of extensive testing which showed that this point is the optimal one for fuel efficiency. Running EV at speeds >65 mph might give better numbers on very short trips when leaving home with a high SOC; otherwise I'm very skeptical about this change.

 

My AC works just fine; if one doesn't set it on 62° and leaves it on a reasonable # like 75, it doesn't seem to affect economy significantly, and Empower guages show that it's not drawing much current in a steady state at that setting. In a 5-mile trip around my neighborhood yesterday afternoon with the AC on and the outside temp at 90°, I got 48 mpg. I don't think I want anyone changing the function of my AC until I know how it's going to affect performance.

 

I'm actually highly satisfied with my FFH, at least in the middle of summer, and I'm leery about making these changes at this point. Never having driven it in winter weather, I might change my tune after experiencing that, but for now I think I want to wait to see what early adopters find with the update. I hope it's not something that Ford has come up with in desperation to affect the course of the lawsuits. The numbers belonged to the EPA. The choice to advertise them and hype them was Ford's, and it's at least conceivable that they could be frightened enough to release a band-aid patch that's not been sufficiently tested. This idea of EV mode at 85 mph might be OK for a Tesla, but it seems so far-fetched for a FFH, that it makes me suspicious.

[hybridbear]

I may be by myself here, probably am, but I am not going to rush to the dealer to have this firmware update applied immediately. As I do a high percentage of my driving on the freeway, I almost shudder to think of running along in EV mode at 70 mph, let alone 85. Eighty-five-mph EV will NOT improve performance other than on steep downgrades -- i.e., I'm pretty sure that they decided on the 62-mph cut-off on the basis of extensive testing which showed that this point is the optimal one for fuel efficiency. Running EV at speeds >65 mph might give better numbers on very short trips when leaving home with a high SOC; otherwise I'm very skeptical about this change.

 

My AC works just fine; if one doesn't set it on 62° and leaves it on a reasonable # like 75, it doesn't seem to affect economy significantly, and Empower guages show that it's not drawing much current in a steady state at that setting. In a 5-mile trip around my neighborhood yesterday afternoon with the AC on and the outside temp at 90°, I got 48 mpg. I don't think I want anyone changing the function of my AC until I know how it's going to affect performance.

 

I'm actually highly satisfied with my FFH, at least in the middle of summer, and I'm leery about making these changes at this point. Never having driven it in winter weather, I might change my tune after experiencing that, but for now I think I want to wait to see what early adopters find with the update. I hope it's not something that Ford has come up with in desperation to affect the course of the lawsuits. The numbers belonged to the EPA. The choice to advertise them and hype them was Ford's, and it's at least conceivable that they could be frightened enough to release a band-aid patch that's not been sufficiently tested. This idea of EV mode at 85 mph might be OK for a Tesla, but it seems so far-fetched for a FFH, that it makes me suspicious.

Agreed. Since we have DFSO when we go down a hill at speeds greater than 62 MPH the ICE stays on but the injectors shut off so it isn't consuming fuel. I don't see how increasing the EV threshold will improve MPGs, I fear that this change will actually make highway MPGs worse. But at the same time I feel like we should trust that the Ford engineers know what they're doing.

 

I have a better idea as to why they think that's okay too. The guy I spoke to the 3rd time I checked up on my car (after 4 work days) said "It should be done by tomorrow evening, until then you can just keep your rental!" in a tone that made it seem like a car is a car, and you have a car to drive so no problem! Noooo, this ugly Ginger Ale Taurus with no features is not MY car, give me my car. haha.

 

Edit: I should also note that they expected me to fill the tank back up when I returned it. I filled it to the point that I would have needed to fill my Fusion and no more. I feel that is fair.

I agree. I don't want to be driving a Focus or an Impala or any other rental car. I want my FFH! And I don't want to have to spend extra money putting gas in the inefficient rental car. Be careful in practice of not returning the rental with as much gas as when you left because Enterprise will charge you if you don't. If it's a loaner from the dealer then I'd put less gas in and tell them why. Next time our FFH has to go in for a few days I'm going to tell them that I want a C-Max or FFH to drive.

[smr2112]

 

Right? The HVB charge level in the Hybrid will last what, all of a 1/4 mile at 85mph?

 

Oh, but if you're coasting downhill or on a long decline and get it above 62 (not hard to do),

the engine won't be on and there is a gas savings right there.

[GrySql]

If it's a loaner from the dealer then I'd put less gas in and tell them why. Next time our FFH has to go in for a few days I'm going to tell them that I want a C-Max or FFH to drive.

The only problem with that is my Dealer uses Enterprise as the Loaner fleet, they have a desk on the showroom floor - and whatever is in the lot is what you get (sometimes). I pushed it real hard this last time because all they had were older cars that smelled real bad or little econoboxes. Enterprise actually sent to the local Enterprise parking lot and got me a new Escape. The Dealer just told them to make the rental equal or better, Enterprise had to scramble.

I also saw the rental rate for my car, $24 @ day for the Escape Dealer price.

 

Regarding gas in the Rental car, that again is an Enterprise policy, not my Dealer's. Enterprise told me to take my gas issue to the Service Advisor, which I did.

I gave my Rental gas receipts to him and it had to go up a level to get approval.

I was offered Ford Owner Advantage credit on future service or a check to be mailed to me. I made it easy and just had them put in my FOA account, that way it stayed at the Dealer and I can use it for service charges (I have over $60 in that account now).

Edited July 17, 2013 by GrySql

[Nick P]

I would be careful about waiting too long to get the upgrade. I get the impression from what I've read that at some point Ford will start charging for the upgrade. The question I have is: My car is running great and my lifetime MPG is at 50.3. If I get the upgrade and my performance goes down, can I get the old software re-installed? I doubt that will happen because the faster warm up and better cold weather performance can only help but you never know.

 

Now, if I can only get the right shifter put on, and get the parts in for the clunking sound from the axle, I'll be in good shape.

[djminfll]

I just saw this link to the story. I know the article has already been presented, but I thought this was interesting for the video attached. It is a series of AT&T commercials from the 90's showing what "the future" holds. Is amazing how many things that seemed futuristic are common place today.

http://www.thecarconnection.com/news/1085604_ford-c-max-fusion-lincoln-mkz-hybrids-get-more-mpgs-via-software-update#src=10065

Edited July 17, 2013 by djminfll

[HenryVIII]

Ha told you acdii! ;)

[acdii]

<clueless

 

What?

[Fynack]

Wow!!! Holy Cow!!! Ford did something. Unfortunately this only proves guilt. Why else make all theses drastic changes when the MPG is supposedly going to be the same. I see more lawsuits and more ammo for the class action suit.

 

But I do see all the changes improving MPG so its win for the consumer.

Edited July 17, 2013 by Fynack

[corncobs]

The question I have is: My car is running great and my lifetime MPG is at 50.3. If I get the upgrade and my performance goes down, can I get the old software re-installed? I doubt that will happen because the faster warm up and better cold weather performance can only help but you never know.

That would be my question as well. What happens if now after the update the interstate mileage drops because of the higher EV speed cut off. Causing my trip average to drop.

Then again if it does improve the cold weather FE it might be worth the loss of 2 MPG in the sommer month when we can gain 4-5 MPG in winter and short trips.

[Fynack]

Agreed. Since we have DFSO when we go down a hill at speeds greater than 62 MPH the ICE stays on but the injectors shut off so it isn't consuming fuel. I don't see how increasing the EV threshold will improve MPGs, I fear that this change will actually make highway MPGs worse. But at the same time I feel like we should trust that the Ford engineers know what they're doing.

 

I have to disagree, having a higher threshold for EV ONLY will allow your car to go into EV ONLY at normal highway speeds. Sure, it wont be a lot and the road will have to be flat or slightly downhill but itll get you more MPGs then the current instruction to use ICE+EV at anything above 62 unless your going on a steep hill. Just having the engine shut off for 10 to 15 seconds here and there at 70mph will only gain you mpgs. I dont see it hurting it.

 

 

[hybridbear]

Oh, but if you're coasting downhill or on a long decline and get it above 62 (not hard to do),

the engine won't be on and there is a gas savings right there.

See this post

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/7188-software-updates-from-ford-to-improve-mpgs/?p=60165

 

Since we have DFSO the ICE stays running but uses no gas already when we're traveling faster than 62 MPH but don't need the power of the ICE

[Waldo]

See this post

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/7188-software-updates-from-ford-to-improve-mpgs/?p=60165

 

Since we have DFSO the ICE stays running but uses no gas already when we're traveling faster than 62 MPH but don't need the power of the ICE

 

A spinning engine still creates more friction than one that isn't spinning, regardless of how much fuel is injected. That's one of the fundamental principles of a hybrid powertrain. Energy lost by that friction is energy that is no longer available for regen.

Edited July 17, 2013 by Waldo