Won't run in EV mode, ICE kicks in immediately.

[goody1926]

 

Ah yes, looking back through this thread, it's automate and iolder discussing. Now I understand what he meant about 1/2 division vs. 2.5-3 divisions. So perhaps people see 3 divisions of power sometimes with a new battery pack. I'm seeing up to 1 right now, so a little better than automate's image, but still not great.

 

Iolder says this is symptomatic of aging battery. Boo. I guess we're coming up on a 10 year old battery pack. What can I do?

 

Now that mine seems to be showing aging and performance down to 1 division or less I am considering some of these shops that claim off vehicle reconditioning. One shop wants about $500 for a 2-3 day recondition process. This shop also offers recondition plus cell replacement should they come across one or more bad ones. The shop also has brand new packs available for considerably more.

 

As I mentioned before mine came on all of a sudden after it set barely used for 6 months during the airbag recall.

 

Has anyone taken this step of a 3rd party reconditioning or reconditioning and repair? How about any shareable experience going with an entirely new pack or maybe even one from a salvage yard?

[dogo88]

When I had my FFH 2010 last Dec, I contacted a company that looks to have nationwide coverage, with installers that will come to your site and install the replacement. They offered two choices: new and remanufactured. Neither was an OEM battery. The new had a 36 month warranty and reman had 18 month. Cost was $3400 new and $2700 reman. If you took it to their install locations. They said installation would take a couple of hours. Onsite installation was more.

 

What made be decide to trade it in on a new 2019 FFH, which I absolutely love, instead of getting the battery replaced was a couple of things. Fist the vehicle was almost 10 years old and had no serious issues. Actually was the least expensive vehicle I have ever owned. But at 10 year things we going to start to go. And all are not inexpensive. But the key issue that made me decide to not change the battery was in talking to the tech support person he pointed out these were not FORD OEM battery but a less expensive replacement. He said OEM batteries were very expensive. And second, if any other electrical components needed replacement that would be an added cost.

 

My thought process was, if I get a replacement and have an electrical issue, they may say it's a Ford issue, and when I take it to Ford, they will tell me it's a replacement battery issue. So I cut my loses and traded it in. Some may argue that Ford is getting out of the car business and that wasn't a very good idea. While true they will not be selling many cars in the future, they still are into hybrids. I believe they will be coming out with a F150 hybrid based upon some articles I've read. Time will tell if it was a bad decision.

 

Dan

[goody1926]

When I had my FFH 2010 last Dec, I contacted a company that looks to have nationwide coverage, with installers that will come to your site and install the replacement. They offered two choices: new and remanufactured. Neither was an OEM battery. The new had a 36 month warranty and reman had 18 month. Cost was $3400 new and $2700 reman. If you took it to their install locations. They said installation would take a couple of hours. Onsite installation was more.

 

What made be decide to trade it in on a new 2019 FFH, which I absolutely love, instead of getting the battery replaced was a couple of things. Fist the vehicle was almost 10 years old and had no serious issues. Actually was the least expensive vehicle I have ever owned. But at 10 year things we going to start to go. And all are not inexpensive. But the key issue that made me decide to not change the battery was in talking to the tech support person he pointed out these were not FORD OEM battery but a less expensive replacement. He said OEM batteries were very expensive. And second, if any other electrical components needed replacement that would be an added cost.

 

My thought process was, if I get a replacement and have an electrical issue, they may say it's a Ford issue, and when I take it to Ford, they will tell me it's a replacement battery issue. So I cut my loses and traded it in. Some may argue that Ford is getting out of the car business and that wasn't a very good idea. While true they will not be selling many cars in the future, they still are into hybrids. I believe they will be coming out with a F150 hybrid based upon some articles I've read. Time will tell if it was a bad decision.

 

Dan

 

The same thoughts also crossed my mind when thinking about how things might go down hill even further being almost 10 years and counting. I am pretty sure I would not go the aftermarket new or reman route at this point due to cost. Not looking forward to what happens if the battery fails completely eventually.

[itsfun4u]

I am new to this forum - just found you recently.

 

Unfortunately, I must join the group of Fusion Hybrid owners who have experienced drive train problems since the air bag recall. The symptoms reported by others are exactly the same as my current experience.

 

I have had the car in to the Ford dealer twice since the recall to address the issues, but with no success. Dealer has consulted with a Ford technician on their "hot line", but has not been able to get an answer.

 

I provided a copy of the suggestions offered on this forum for "re-balancing" the high voltage battery, which he indicates that he has done, but with no success.

 

Any additional suggestions? Does anyone have a suggestion of how to reach someone at Ford Motor who really might care about fixing this problem?

[wmayo]

Same exact symptoms here (w/2010 model). No EV in ANY acceleration, even mild on level ground.

Sounds like the rebalancing of HV battery may be the solution. It did start the problem during air bag recall, but I DROVE it regularly (modest miles). EV problem started about the 6th month waiting for air bags.

As far as life of battery. I came across a taxi company in NY that had 200 Fusion (2010) hybrids. The guy told me that at 9 years, there have been NO failures of any HV batteries, and they are running just fine. That doesn't mean that 1 in 500 won't have our problem. But no actual failures for that many is pretty good.

Local dealer here is clueless. Just put $2,000 on car at dealer to replace a couple of valves I've never heard of, and a brake job. Gonna be hard to put another $500 in it.

Edited March 15, 2019 by wmayo

[wmayo]

I have two 2010 Mercury Milan Hybrids that were in storage for seven months because of the air bag recall. Ford gave me two rental vehicles while it was in storage. I made sure to start the cars every four weeks and run them for 20 to thirty minutes. I also disconnected the 12v battery as directed in the owner's manual. The HV batteries now like to stay in the fully charged state instead of staying in the middle on the gauge and the cars stay mostly in the ICE mode except, when braking and maybe a little in the hybrid mode after traveling over 15 miles (even after fully warmed up). Ford had me sign a statement that I would not use my cars while I had the rental vehicles. Both cars have only 43,000 miles on them. I called Ford and they refused to pay for the hybrid repair. I am waiting for a call back from a Ford supervisor. I feel since I followed the directions in the manual and kept the cars in storage as directed by Ford they should be responsible. I contacted an attorney who is willing to set up a class action to get me reimbursement for getting my two cars repaired. Send me a message if you would like to participle and I will give you his contact information.

Yes, I might be interested.

[Cnaroach]

Craziest thing happened today. My 2010 FFH hasn't worked in EV since the airbag recall fix. Dealer had it 12 days, said they rebalanced the HVB twice and it still didn't work. The weather here in Virginia has been high in the 50s at best. Today it was warm, mid 70s, and all of a sudden EV started mostly working. Comes on anytime I hit the brakes, come to a stop, even stays on with light pressure on the accelerator. I still can't get it up to more than a few miles per hour, but I got over 40 miles per gallon all day (compared to the 30 mpg when it was cool outside.) Still not 100% back to normal, but it's much better.

[Cnaroach]

Craziest thing happened today. My 2010 FFH hasn't worked in EV since the airbag recall fix. Dealer had it 12 days, said they rebalanced the HVB twice and it still didn't work. The weather here in Virginia has been high in the 50s at best. Today it was warm, mid 70s, and all of a sudden EV started mostly working. Comes on anytime I hit the brakes, come to a stop, even stays on with light pressure on the accelerator. I still can't get it up to more than a few miles per hour, but I got over 40 miles per gallon all day (compared to the 30 mpg when it was cool outside.) Still not 100% back to normal, but it's much better.

[markwilson66]

I've noticed a very minor MPG improvement since the weather is beginning to warm up.
38 MPG vs 37 MPG in cooler temps. Still not the same as the 41 MPG I was averaging before without even trying. If I worked at it (hypermiling) I could get 46 MPG.

[PaulGo]

Yes, I might be interested.

I left you a PM with the name of my attorney.

 

So far Ford has not found a solution to fixing my two cars. I brought one into my local Ford dealer and the service manager test drove the car after the service people reprogrammed the computer to Fords recommendations and verified the problem was not fixed. The dealership test equipment shows no errors in the HV system. (The one car that the Ford dealer has tried to fix has been at the dealer three time of a total of twelve days). Now that the weather has warmed up my two cars are also performing better in the hybrid mode. However the HV battery level indicator stays above the normal mid-range level which indicates the storage has degraded the HV battery. It also take more driving before it goes into the somewhat normal hybrid mode.

 

Cold weather appears to further degrade the ability of the HV battery to reach its normal charge level so I assume that is why it will not go into the hybrid mode during the winter months. It is very frustrating that my two cars with low mileage were both performing perfectly as hybrids before it went into storage for seven months and because of this air bag related storage the HV battery seems to have been degraded.

[Cnaroach]

Today it's cool outside again (50s) aaaaannnndddd no EV. UGH.

[mmtphoto]

Add me to the growing list of FFH owners experiencing this problem. Mine also started to act up after sitting for the airbag recall for months. No acceleration in EV at all with some very limited EV cruising at slower speeds. I have about 62k on mine (2010). Seems a potential leading theory is the HVB pack that has potentially degraded significantly and rebalancing might not or may no longer be able to cure it.

 

I went to the dealer a couple days ago just for an initial inquiry. I already have a routine P2450 and intermittent tire pressure sensor failure that they said would need fixed before they would even try to diagnose the EV mode problem. I had the P2450 prior to the airbag recall timeout and the EV mode was working just fine then.

 

I have yet to begin research on how to diagnose and repair the TPS failure. Unfortunately it did not set a code or my OBD reader is just too old. Since it tends to come on after several miles then after several more miles of driving goes off maybe I need to check codes while the MIL is lit.

 

It seems that even with those fixed then going back to the dealer might still result in their inability to figure it out.

 

Maybe I should just ask them to force a rebalancing and go from there. Does anyone know of a particular brand OBD tool or software plus adapter that can force a rebalance?

 

 

i have a Autel MD 808 scanner and it will balance the hybrid batteries, Ive done mine since the recall was done and it does make a noticeable difference. they sell for about 200-250. The batteries have to be over 60F for the rebalance to take effect, so I parked mine in my garage fired up a 35,000 btu propane heater for a few hours to get it to happen. Doing this in conjunction with slightly warmer weather seems to have made the HV drive more functional, and if it ever acts like spring here, I suspect the combination of rebalance and temps over 60 will hopefuly get things back to normal. But I will add that, having our Hybrid for 3 winters now, this winter has shown how much the layoff of 7 months affects the HV system. These cars do not do well sitting for extended periods of time which, if you think about it, is pretty common for most cars anyway. Makes you wonder if Ford really thought this through.

Edited March 18, 2019 by mmtphoto

[markwilson66]

@mmtphoto What is the feature of the Autel MD 808 that performs the High Voltage Battery rebalancing? I scanned the online user's manual and it appears the only battery features are related to the 12v battery.

[mmtphoto]

@mmtphoto What is the feature of the Autel MD 808 that performs the High Voltage Battery rebalancing? I scanned the online user's manual and it appears the only battery features are related to the 12v battery.

in the battery function it also has a balancing function as a choice for the HV battery. Both the MD 808 and the MD 808 Pro do this.

Edited March 18, 2019 by mmtphoto

[jake1110]

I too am having issues with all of the above on my 2010 FFH. I just crossed 150k miles last week. The car itself was originally sold in late 2009 so it's nearing 10 years old.

 

My car has reduced acceleration power in EV mode and will only use EV mode when stopped. EV acceleration is near non-existent. I also have the delayed acceleration issue, which I'm sure is directly related to the reduced EV power. I'm in the Midwest and after several warmer than average winters, we had a brutally cold one and the acceleration lag seems exacerbated by the extreme cold.

 

It's unfortunate as I've had zero issues with this car. It's ran so well for me. I think I'm going to hold onto it for another year though and hope the battery doesn't fail. At this point, I'm not really wanting to sink any money into a replacement battery, but would consider it if there was a total failure. That said, this is the end of the line of Fusion's and I think I'm going to look for a PHEV after this with a decent hatch. I've heard the 2020 Escape will have a PHEV variant, so I'm watching closely

[Cnaroach]

Jake, did you just have the airbag recall done? Seems like most people I've seen having this problem just got their Fusions back from the dealer (myself included.)

[markwilson66]

Here's an interesting product. It's used to rebalance the HVB on hybrid vehicles. They don't specifically mention a unit for the Ford Fusion but there is some decent information on the need for this type of reconditioning.
https://hybridautomotive.com/

BTW, I contacted Ford Customer Care the other day and was told to take my Fusion to another Ford dealer for a second opinion after being told it was a "normal characteristic of vehicle".

[PaulGo]

Ask Ford if they will pay for the second opinion. My dealership has contacted Ford Motor Company several times for assistance. The only assistance they gave was to program the computer so it knows it is a 10 year old vehicle. That did not work. I have also called Ford many times asking them to give assistance to my dealer. During the last call they also suggested I bring the cars to another dealer. I told them that the other dealer would also be calling Ford for assistance so what good would it do. Ford is either unwilling or unable to provide any additional assistance to my dealership. I believe Ford knows it is responsible for this because of the long term storage that my two cars were subjected to because of the airbag recall but does not want to admit liability.

[markwilson66]

They told me that any additional diagnosis would be my responsibility. Ford is trying to wash their hands of this, hoping we all just go away.
Anyone here on Twitter, I encourage you to tweet @FordService and complain, it will probably fall on deaf ears but you never know.

[PaulGo]

I even sent a letter to the head of Ford Motor Company, as expected it was never answered. I think our only option is a class action lawsuit.

[jake1110]

Jake, did you just have the airbag recall done? Seems like most people I've seen having this problem just got their Fusions back from the dealer (myself included.)

 

I haven't yet, but received the airbag recall notice last month. Last winter my 12v battery died and I changed it for the first time and it idled a bit weird for a while but that was resolved.

 

I should also note that my car has never sat unused for 30 days. At most, it's went 20 days just once and that was in my garage. Otherwise, it's been continually used. Not sure if I really have any other options, so I'm just dealing with the weak HVB. It's been in the 50's here and I haven't gotten any pure EV driving. When I'm braking coming up to a light, it goes to EV mode, then, right before coming to a complete stop, the engine turns on briefly and finally, once I'm stopped, it goes to EV. It's really bizarre and definitely something that hasn't happened before in my car. Immediately after I take my foot off the brake, it runs the engine.

[Cnaroach]

Jake, mine is doing the exact same things. One day last week it was warm out, I got it to coast in EV and if I was really, really gentle on the accelerator I could get it to move forward under electric power.

[murphy]

When the 12 volt battery is disconnected the computer loses the engine settings it has learned. It takes some driving for it to relearn the engine profile.

[Automate]

 

The batteries have to be over 60F for the rebalance to take effect

 

This is interesting. I would guess the automatic rebalancing done by your car would have the same requirement. So if your car detects a rebalance is needed, but you live in a cold climate, you may be waiting till Spring for the automatic rebalance to occur.

[itsfun4u]

to PaulGo

 

I too would like the contact information for your attorney dealing with this unresolved Ford Motor issue. Thanks.

My email is rgwalton17022@gmail.com