Tires, any favorites? Michelin Defender, Premier A/S, Energy Saver

[Sky14FFH]

I'm a little late to be asking this since I already bought some tires on a deal on BF but thought I'd bring up the question anyway. I decided not to go with the Michelin Energy Savers this time around because they were terrible in the snow and they are reputed to have weak sidewalls. (I actually had a small bulge in one after hitting a curb last spring and was glad to get rid of them. But I wanted to get Michelins again just because I am so impressed with the Destinys I got for my other car. Seems like they are going to outlast the car. So with the Fusion it was a toss up between the 80,000 Defenders (that must be the current evolution of the Destinys) and the Premier A/S. I decided to go with the Premier A/S and hope I made the right decision. According to reviews they are pretty good in the snow, excellent in the rain and stop faster than most tires in the dry, and according to Michelin's brochure better on fuel economy than the Defenders but only a notch worse than the Energy Savers. When comparing them with the Defenders I only noticed that the Defenders had much deeper tread so I expect to replace these after the car gets over 100,000 miles. So far I have experienced noticeably better steering response but haven't had much chance to test them in any other way.

Edit: Aug 2, 2019 Ok I have mixed feelings about the Premier A/Ss. I haven't yet been able to get an above 50mpg tank all summer. Granted it may have something to with my driving but I think it is also the tires because I can usually compensate. I am approaching a 600 mile tank now as I write this so see if I can get over 50 next fill up. I did get a nail/screw but upon discovering it headed over to Costco where I got them and they fixed it quickly before I lost any air. I had no idea how much difference the energy savers made until now but I am thinking it is about 4mpg less now which translates to about 48 miles per tank. Somewhat significant.

Edited August 2, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[Larry Twitchell]

I just replaced my EnergySavers with Defender T+H primarily because Consumer Reports recommendations. The Energy Savers were original equipment and lasted 45.7K miles, better than any tire Ive had in many years, but less than the suggested 55K. Rotation every 5K was done religiously, which I intend to do with the Defenders. I, too, see much deeper tread depth than the Energy Savers and am hopeful that theyll last longer. Havent driven on them enough to comment yet.

Feb 13, 2019

Now have driven nearly 5k on the Defenders and have noticed a drop in MPG beyond what I have seen in previous winters. A long day of driving through rain in VA and N.C. demonstrated that they are very good on wet pavement. The are noisier than the oem Energy Savers.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Larry Twitchell

[2014FordFusionSE]

I'm going to get the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ and will let you know what I think once I drive them around a bit.

I only wish the name was shorter :)

If I don't like them, I'll switch to the Defenders. Defenders have a longer tread life but I don't drive that much.

 

The Energy Savers lasted about 40k miles. They would probably go 5k more but I don't want to wait until they are bald.

[Sky14FFH]

I got 54800 out of the energy savers and they were rated for 55,000 so I guess I trust Michelin's treadware claims. So far I've had the Premier A/Ss and they GRIP and I am very happy with them so far. They don't make any of the squeeling sounds when turning in parking lots and do not break loose when hitting on ramps fast like the Energy Savers did. Because of global warming I haven't be able to test them in the snow yet. It has been ridiculously warm. They have a 60,000 treadware. Michelin rated them second to the Energy Savers in low rolling resistance according to their brochure, or I would have gotten the defenders but I noticed the inside tread instead of running straight zigzaged/or alternated and looked like they'd have more drag. Defenders would be a VERY sensible choice if you never want to buy tires again however. Every so often I wonder if I should have got them instead but I'm into safety these days with how bad people drive. I also was shooting for more comfort and if the defenders have a good comfort level the Premier A/S were just a bit better. I may notice slightly more road noise with them than the energy savers however, but it isn't much. The pilots didn't seem to get good ratings on tirerack so I didn't consider them for long. Correct me if I am wrong,was researching it 2 months ago.

Edited January 9, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[ethermion]

We found the factory Michelins to be more like wagon wheels. They did last a long time, but that is because they had poor traction.

 

Now sporting Goodyear Eagle F1 all season. I use the same shoes on my race day car. Got maybe 30k miles on the fronts before replacement, rears look new. Massive improvement in inclement weather (rain or snow) - just massive. Butt dyno says launch, braking, turning, also noticeably improved.

 

Be mindful that low rolling resistance tires, have low rolling resistance. It is the resistance that connects you to the road. Think about that.

[Cobra348]

We found the factory Michelins to be more like wagon wheels. They did last a long time, but that is because they had poor traction.

 

Now sporting Goodyear Eagle F1 all season. I use the same shoes on my race day car. Got maybe 30k miles on the fronts before replacement, rears look new. Massive improvement in inclement weather (rain or snow) - just massive. Butt dyno says launch, braking, turning, also noticeably improved.

 

Be mindful that low rolling resistance tires, have low rolling resistance. It is the resistance that connects you to the road. Think about that.

I think you will find the LRR Michelins from Ford are dry/wet rated, not snow/ice. I've found - on Neons, Fiestas and FFHs - that using snow tires in Winter and the OEM tread (or similar LRR) non-Winter works well. So, directional Goodyear tread is on now with OEM rims. Come March/April Tirerack rims and OEM tread go on.

[ptjones]

We found the factory Michelins to be more like wagon wheels. They did last a long time, but that is because they had poor traction.

 

Now sporting Goodyear Eagle F1 all season. I use the same shoes on my race day car. Got maybe 30k miles on the fronts before replacement, rears look new. Massive improvement in inclement weather (rain or snow) - just massive. Butt dyno says launch, braking, turning, also noticeably improved.

 

Be mindful that low rolling resistance tires, have low rolling resistance. It is the resistance that connects you to the road. Think about that.

What tire pressure where you using? I find the Michelin's work well at 50 psi and I use them in all weather conditions. :)

 

Paul

[Sky14FFH]

Be mindful that low rolling resistance tires, have low rolling resistance. It is the resistance that connects you to the road. Think about that.

Yeahhhh but no I've been thinking about these things for decades and low rolling resistance does not equal low grip. The two have little to do with each other, maybe negligible. For example, slicks will be very grippy in dry weather for example but at high PSI have very low rolling resistance. You can have high LRR and high grip tires and slippery tires with low rolling resistance which is often the case when tires get old - especially with the Energy Savers - when they got old they got worse in every way.

 

Paul, I keep my PSI at 36 in the winter and 38 in the summer and got several 600+mile tanks this past couple years with a couple tense 700+mile tanks.

 

I don't recommend directional tires (and I learned this the hard way) they can throw your alignment off or the way your car tracks down the road. Dealership I was getting alignments at insisted this for years when I had directional Perellis on a car until I got new tires and turned out the wheels were aligned all along.

Edited January 9, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[Waldo]

 

 

I don't recommend directional tires (and I learned this the hard way) they can throw your alignment off or the way your car tracks down the road. Dealership I was getting alignments at insisted this for years when I had directional Perellis on a car until I got new tires and turned out the wheels were aligned all along.

 

I don't think that has anything to do with directional tires. More likely just poor Pirelli quality control or the fact the in general, directional tires are meant to be more sporty, which generally means stiffer sidewalls, which generally means more sensitivity to road ruts.

Edited January 10, 2019 by Waldo

[Sky14FFH]

Well ask a dealership. They insisted on it and it didn't have to do with their being Pirellis. They just said sometimes directional tires make it appear as if your alignment is not true and it will cause the car to not track straight. For example, on a straight flat freeway take your grip off the wheel while keeping your hands around it. If the car doesn't keep the lane at least for a 1/4 mile then something is wrong. I didn't believe them either. They got the alignment as close as it had been since new but it still wasn't perfectly true and would vere left, constantly. Originally I believed they were putting too much toe in as they said they do on front wheel drive cars. It wasn't until I got Michellin Destinys did that stop happening. In college I had a Ford Probe that was so well aligned/designed it would keep the lane for miles almost like it was on autopilot. Since then I've been spoiled and expect my alignment to be perfect.

Edited January 10, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[Waldo]

All tires have "residual self aligning torque" which determines how much the tire itself can cause a vehicle to pull in one direction or another. It actually doesn't matter which side of the car or which direction the tire is rotating, it will always cause a pull in the same direction. There is also tire "conicity" which can cause a vehicle to pull if the tires on one side are worse than on the other. If you flip them from one side to the other the vehicle will pull in the opposite direction.

 

Self aligning torque is general a designed-in part of the tire while conicity is generally a quality control issue. But neither has anything to do with a being a directional tire, but either one would explain the condition you had.

[Sky14FFH]

So apparently according to your explanation, and Ford's, directional tires tend to have "residual self aligning torque" that causes "a pull in the same direction" because the car always pulled in the same direction...until I stopped using directional tires.

 

Here's a long discussion on it. http://www.automotiveforums.com/t886417-what_causes_a_tire_pull.html

 

"Polygon

02-02-2008, 05:24 PM

Lots of things can cause tire pull.

1. Uneven tire wear.
2. Out of alignment.
3. Directional tires put on the wrong way."

"goongrinch

02-03-2008, 03:29 PM

just for more input when i put a set of four brand new directional tires on, set the alignment, and the car pulls, lets say in this case to the left, i will rotate front to back the right side, that is the general rule i was taught and a majority of the time this will fix the problem with the directional tires"

 

The take away: Directional tires add an extra factor of entropy that could lead to your car pulling one way or another. So if you would rather reduce the probability of problems occurring do not add extra factors of entropy.

Edited January 11, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[Waldo]

No, my explanation has nothing at all to do with directional tires. Any tire can cause a pull to one side. Sometimes swapping the tires to the other side (which you can't do with directional tires) can make it pull the other way, sometimes not.

The fact that your issue was resolved after changing your tires just means you had a bad set of tires, has nothing at all to do with them being directional.

[md13ffhguy]

I got 87k miles out of the 17" OEM Michelin Energy Savers on my previous 2013. I drive gently and never wanted for more handling or traction. My wife drives a little harder and got 75k+ from the same tires on her 2014. I rotate with oil changes at 10k miles.

 

I replaced mine with the Continental tires that a lot of people on here were raving about a few years back. Hated them, as efficiency dropped significantly with my car. Swapped them to my wife's car and efficiency was impacted less, since she doesn't drive nearly as efficiently as I do. Went back to OEM on mine and efficiency went right back up. I'm sticking with the OEM Michelin Energy Savers.

 

Current 2018 has 18" version of the Michelins. Will probably stick with them if they can last 70k+, like my previous experience with the other cars.

[mwr]

I got 87k miles out of the 17" OEM Michelin Energy Savers on my previous 2013. I drive gently and never wanted for more handling or traction. My wife drives a little harder and got 75k+ from the same tires on her 2014. I rotate with oil changes at 10k miles.

What tire pressure do you use?

[md13ffhguy]

What tire pressure do you use?

A bit higher than recommended, but not controversially high... 38-40.

[Cobra348]

I run 40 cold year round - regardless of the tire. I check and reinflate about once every 4-6 weeks. With TPMS monitor in my car now, I have an approximation instead of having to yank out the compressor.

[2014FordFusionSE]

Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ review after a week of driving. These replaced the OEM Energy Savers:

 

Short story, the mileage went from 41 mpg to 37 mpg (10% drop)

Tire pressure is 37.5 psi, filled by America's Tire on install.

My OEMs were 35 psi all the time, rotated at 10k during service.

 

Longer story:

When they were first installed, the ICE kicked in all the time. I had reset the fuel economy gauge on install. The grip was really good, there was a lot of resistance and I almost felt like I was driving with low tire pressure.

After I drove it a few times on the freeway, crossing 75mph, it seems that the tires 'smoothened' up a bit and the resistance on the road felt less.

 

The first 2 days, I saw 35 mpg which freaked me out a bit, but then the mileage got better. This is my usual day-to-day commute and random weekend driving.

The first day itself was dry and then it rained a lot at night so I got to test them in wet and dry weather. Everything about the tire is great so far, and I expected the gas mileage drop.

 

The tires are also pretty quiet and the cushioning is good. I've seen reviews where they claim to 'drone' on the freeway, etc but I haven't experienced any of that.

They definitely grip very well on turns. The OEM Energy Savers seemed to slide a bit on turns.

 

I'll update my experience in a month or so. Looks like I'll be keeping them unless something changes within my 30-day 'exchange' period.

 

Let me know if you have any specific questions.

[klatoo]

On my Fusion, replaced stock around 28K because I was tired of replacing tires due to nails etc so I wanted a warranty. Purchased Continental Purecontact with Ecoplus, rotate every 5K and check tire pressure with every fill up (34psi) and will need to replace in the next 5-7000....therefore they lasted 32-37k miles

 

Need to try higher PSI I guess. Memphis has hot summers so maybe that’s it? I have it aligned yearly...unsure why else poor wear could be the culprit. Will say after buying these tires never did get another flat.

[Sky14FFH]

Honestly I just got a nice bike tire pump on clearance at a bicycle store. Saves me having to go out and hunt for air. Takes about 20 pumps to go up 5psi but after having once hunted for air years ago find it to be well worth it and I enjoy it. Keep it at 36psi in winter 38 in summer. In the 600 and 700 mile club however with winter now my fuel economy has dumped to 42 and 38 on the last two fillups.

[Cobra348]

I carry a Slime 12v compressor in the car. Plugs right into the 12v socket, you can set shutoff pressure. Has several fittings for footballs, etc. What I like about it versus some of the public air supplies is that the hose screws onto the valve stem so you need not hold it on. About $25 or so at AutoZone or similar. Just let the car idle while you use it.

Edited January 25, 2019 by Cobra348

[2014FordFusionSE]

Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ review after a week of driving. These replaced the OEM Energy Savers:

 

Short story, the mileage went from 41 mpg to 37 mpg (10% drop)

Tire pressure is 37.5 psi, filled by America's Tire on install.

My OEMs were 35 psi all the time, rotated at 10k during service.

 

Longer story:

When they were first installed, the ICE kicked in all the time. I had reset the fuel economy gauge on install. The grip was really good, there was a lot of resistance and I almost felt like I was driving with low tire pressure.

After I drove it a few times on the freeway, crossing 75mph, it seems that the tires 'smoothened' up a bit and the resistance on the road felt less.

 

The first 2 days, I saw 35 mpg which freaked me out a bit, but then the mileage got better. This is my usual day-to-day commute and random weekend driving.

The first day itself was dry and then it rained a lot at night so I got to test them in wet and dry weather. Everything about the tire is great so far, and I expected the gas mileage drop.

 

The tires are also pretty quiet and the cushioning is good. I've seen reviews where they claim to 'drone' on the freeway, etc but I haven't experienced any of that.

They definitely grip very well on turns. The OEM Energy Savers seemed to slide a bit on turns.

 

I'll update my experience in a month or so. Looks like I'll be keeping them unless something changes within my 30-day 'exchange' period.

 

Let me know if you have any specific questions.

 

The mpg still hovers between 37 and 38. That said, the tires have been really good in the rain and in dry weather.

I don't experience any of the sliding that I used to with the OEMs.

These are definitely very good tires so far.

[bocaboy]

I have a 2014 FFH and I replaced my original Goodyear Eagles at 40K with Michelin Primacy's. Still getting great mileage and a very quiet ride. I live in S. Florida, so snow, etc., not an issue in making my choice of tires. Got them at Costco while Michelin's were on sale.

 

Good luck!

[Sky14FFH]

delete - edit added to original post.

Edited August 2, 2019 by Sky14FFH

[ptjones]

SKY14FFH said:

Edit: Aug 2, 2019 Ok I have mixed feelings about the Premier A/Ss. I haven't yet been able to get an above 50mpg tank all summer. Granted it may have something to with my driving but I think it is also the tires because I can usually compensate. I am approaching a 600 mile tank now as I write this so see if I can get over 50 next fill up. I did get a nail/screw but upon discovering it headed over to Costco where I got them and they fixed it quickly before I lost any air. I had no idea how much difference the energy savers made until now but I am thinking it is about 4mpg less now which translates to about 48 miles per tank. Somewhat significant.

There is a reason why FORD and others use the Michelin AS ES because of they get the best MPG's and as I have found using 50 SPI will improve mpg's more and make tires last longer too. :)

Paul