Stop Safely Now in hot weather

[rmart]

I have read quite a few threads on this forum and my Stop Safely Now experience seems a bit different than others I have read about. I am scheduled to have the dealer do diagnostics to my 2010 FFH, 116000 miles in June and am trying to educate myself before I take the car to the dealer.

 

I was travelling on I-40 across the Mohave Desert (lots of truck traffic) out in the middle of no where. The outside temperature was 105F, the AC was on and I was zipping along at 80 MPH. The engine temperature was perfectly centered in its range. First the yellow wrench light came on after I stopped for gas outside of Barstow. This has happened before when its very hot outside so I was not surprised. The yellow wrench light usually goes away if the ignition is turned off and then restarted. Being on the interstate I continued on. When I was really out in the middle of no where the dreaded ding ding ding chimed on and the Stop Safely Now message was flashing. There was no power available. Its as if the car drive system shut down. Slipping between trucks going 70 mph, I was able to maneuver to the side of the road. I shut down the car, waited a couple of minutes and restarted the car with the AC off. My FFH worked perfectly normal. I drove to the nearest Ford Dealer in Needles as I thought my 12V battery was bad but the battery tested good for full load operation. I continued on my trip to New Mexico with no further problems. This was over a month ago and the FFH operates perfectly normal - but it has also not been over 100 F.

 

It seems this issue of the yellow wrench and this instance of Stop Safely Now is related to outside temperature. When it is above 100 F out there the yellow wrench is prone to come on. I am wondering if there are temperature sensors or cooling systems that could be under rated? I am really worried about being out in the desert when its hot especially if there are no people or services around which is the norm in the South West. Like I said I plan to have the dealer do full diagnostics but would like to be armed with ideas from the experts on this forum.

 

Thanks for any ideas - Rob

[murphy]

With that many miles have all of the antifreeze fluids been changed? Engine coolant and electronics coolant. I realize that in the desert you don't need the antifreeze capability but antifreeze can lose its heat transfer capability. I don't know if the temperature gauge on the dash includes the temperature of the electronics coolant. Have the radiator caps pressure tested or just install new ones. Hopefully you are not using plain water instead of antifreeze.

 

Has the brake fluid been changed? It can get moisture in it and the only way to get rid of the moisture is to change the brake fluid.

 

I'm just giving you things that should have been done on a high mileage car. The computer could be monitoring a lot of things that could trigger an error report.

 

Do you try to cram all of the gas you can into the tank? That can destroy the vapor recovery canister.

 

Have the A/C refrigerant level tested. Low refrigerant might increase the current to the compressor and trigger a problem report.

[ElectricFan69]

First step is pulling any codes recorded - and I"m surprised the dealer didn't do so and advise you. Could be your inverter/PSD coolant circuit went over-temp -- as far as I know, that circuit isn't reflected in the cluster display, nor any display screens visible to the driver. That circuit is separate from the ICE circuit, and typically runs at lower temps. With high ambient temps and high load (due to speeds), temp management is going to be a challenge - and if the secondary cooling circuit isn't up to snuff, you'll see the symptoms outlined. Make sure that the level for that reservoir is correct as a first step - but even if it is, you may have issues with things like the heat exchanger or the pump.

[rmart]

Thank you very much murphy and ElectricFan69

I am compiling a list for me to check and for the dealer to be made aware of for things to check.

I routinely have my FFH serviced by Ford and dont pay particular attention to a lot of the maintenance details due to laziness, but will review these items with the dealer and have them recharge or replace regardless. FYI murphy when I filled up, I never top off, I just let it fill until the nozzle pops shut.

I also really feel that its something like the inverter/PSD coolant circuit and I hope to have enough of these possibilities to have the dealer look at them specifically. Can either of you comment on using an ODB II monitor and Torque Pro to continuously monitor for codes? I have heard that ODB II will not catch codes for hybrids. If that is so is there a code monitor out there for hybrids?

I do appreciate your insight on this matter very much so Thanks Again :)

 

Rob

[murphy]

A quality ODB reader will work fine. The $15 ones may be too slow and cause problems on the ODB bus. I use this one:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006NZTZLQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

You can also read major codes from the dash.

 

Hold the left OK button and start the car.
Watch the upper left corner of the left display for the letters ET to appear in yellow.
After the letters appear release the OK button.
Use the down arrow to scroll through the screens.
Press and hold the OK button or shut the car off to exit engineering test mode.

[Texasota]

A quality ODB reader will work fine. The $15 ones may be too slow and cause problems on the ODB bus. I use this one:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006NZTZLQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Murphy, I noticed from that product description that it states:

 

 

Works on all 1996+ cars and light trucks sold in the USA (except hybrid or electric vehicles)

 

Is that incorrect?

[murphy]

I used it on my 2013 Ford Fusion Energi with the Forscan software to turn on my DRLs.

It also works with an Android app called Hybrid Assistant.

It should work with any hybrid although the software that comes with it may not support the Atkinson cycle engine in the hybrid.

It is unlikely to work with a full electric vehicle because they are not required to have an OBD port.

My full electric vehicle has an OBD port but the only thing on it is 12 volts and ground.

[ElectricFan69]

Thank you very much murphy and ElectricFan69

I am compiling a list for me to check and for the dealer to be made aware of for things to check.

I routinely have my FFH serviced by Ford and dont pay particular attention to a lot of the maintenance details due to laziness, but will review these items with the dealer and have them recharge or replace regardless. FYI murphy when I filled up, I never top off, I just let it fill until the nozzle pops shut.

I also really feel that its something like the inverter/PSD coolant circuit and I hope to have enough of these possibilities to have the dealer look at them specifically. Can either of you comment on using an ODB II monitor and Torque Pro to continuously monitor for codes? I have heard that ODB II will not catch codes for hybrids. If that is so is there a code monitor out there for hybrids?

I do appreciate your insight on this matter very much so Thanks Again :)

 

Rob

The issue with many 'lower-end' code readers and associated software is that they don't ' know ' about the superset of OBD codes a hybrid can set- and they typically won't be able to ask the CAN-accessible ECUs for codes. So, the limitation of the 'code readers' is that they can typically access the ICE primary ECU - and interrogate it for the basic codes, and display the results. For the extended fault storage, the 'reader' may need to interrogate other ECUs on the CAN BUS (car area network). This will allow them to 'see' the PSD/transaxle code, the stability control ECU, etc.

 

It's gotten to the point where you need to be a network analyst to figure out who is able to talk to whom ;)

Edited May 29, 2018 by ElectricFan69

[Clint2ba]

I have also had this problem repeatedly with a 2013 ffh. It first started last summer driving from Phoenix to LA. I only had 40k on the car at that time. It seems to happen when we have been driving for around 4 hours straight (highway speeds). Temperatures were over 110 degrees.

 

We had it checked out in Indio, CA and they said there wasn't anything wrong with it. It just got too hot. We had the same problem on the way back going to Phoenix. We waited for it to cool off and it worked fine again. When we returned home we took the car to the dealership and they couldn't find anything wrong. We have since driven several 1000 mile road trips without incident.

 

Then last week I was driving from NE New Mexico to El Paso across the desert and it happened again. Temperature was around 105,and I had been driving for 4 hours. Nursed it back home after letting it cool down for a few hours. It's currently at the dealership.

 

Any ideas? I have searched the forum to see if anyone else had this problem and this is the closest I've found. My wife loves the car, but we live in the desert, take road trips, and have a 4 year old. We can't keep breaking down in high heat.

[lolder]

There's a TSB to increase the electric water pump's speed with software. Tell the dealer to look for it. There have also been reports of problems with the electric system's temperature sensor, connector and wiring. I couldn't find the info on the motor speed increase for either the 2010-12s or 2013+s.

Edited June 14, 2018 by lolder