Whirring noise from ICE

[sschnath]

When the ICE is running, especially when it's cold, I'm hearing a loud whirring noise that increases and decreases with engine RPM. It can be heard in the passenger compartment and it's significantly louder outside. It makes the engine sound significantly louder when it's happening, much louder than even the normal noise for this type of engine.

 

It does not occur when the car is running off the HVB and it doesn't directly correlate to an increase or decrease of MPH so I don't believe it to be transmission related.

 

My gut says it has something to do with the HVB charging system but since everything seems to working just fine it could just be normal noise due to wear (134,000 miles now).

 

But, the water pump is original. On my Passat I was in the habit of changing it out when I changed the timing belt. No requirement to change out the timing belt on these engines so is there a preventative maintenance recommendation for water pump replacement?

Edited April 22, 2018 by sschnath

[lolder]

The water pump(s) are electric.

[sschnath]

Ah, I had (obviously) forgotten about that. Ok, scratch that idea. The usual suspects (power steering pump, alternator, etc) don't apply here which is good and bad!

[brobeo]

I'm having the same issue. Did you identify the problem?

[sschnath]

I'm having the same issue. Did you identify the problem?

 

Not yet. Haven't even popped the hood yet but hoping to take a look tomorrow. How many miles do you have on yours?

 

If it's not immediately obvious I'm thinking I might pull fuses to see if I can narrow it down. It could just be normal mileage-related wear but it's certainly much louder than it was when I picked it up with 16K on it.

 

My daughter will likely get this car next year and I will probably get an MKZ and the outcome may determine whether I get the hybrid again or go with the V6. I like the MPGs I'm getting now but I rack up a lot of highway miles every year and need it to last. I'm also thinking that AWD might be handy for some of the winter driving I have to do.

 

 

 

 

[sschnath]

A couple of clues now:

1. When the fuse for powertrain control module - vehicle power 1 was removed the engine started to run rough and the the sound ran rough with it. I assume the engine was eventually going to die, it didn't let it run that long.

2. When the fuse for powertrain control module - vehicle power 3 & 4 (same fuse) was removed, the engine ran rough but the whirring sound was not there. The engine quickly died with this fuse removed.

3. The whirring sound starts a spit second after the engine starts up. Not quite immediate. When the engine stops the noise stops immediately.

 

Unfortunately, with all the troubleshooting I was doing I did something to the brakes! I feel no pressure in the brakes and I'm getting messages indicating that the traction control needs service, hill assist is not working, and the ABS isn't working. Double-checked the relays and fuses and from what I can tell everything looks ok so not sure what I did.

Edited May 6, 2018 by sschnath

[murphy]

Disconnect the 12 volt battery for 5 minutes to completely reset the car to see if that fixes it.

[sschnath]

Yes, will try that next, thanks for the suggestion. I drove the car and could tell the brakes were still working and about 30 sec after I started driving everything cleared up except the service engine soon icon is still lit. Going to try to disconnect the battery next to see if that goes away.

 

Back to the question at hand, does anyone know what functions are attached to the fuse labeled powertrain control module - vehicle power 3 & 4?

[sschnath]

I found a little more information, doesn't help me much but maybe someone who knows the powertrain can elaborate:

Fuse 7 20A Powertrain control module - vehicle power 1. Powertrain control module power.

Fuse 8 20A Powertrain control module - vehicle power 2. Emission components.

Fuse 11 15A Powertrain control module - vehicle power 4. Ignition coils.

Fuse 12 15A Powertrain control module - vehicle power 3. Non-emission components.

 

It looks like messing with fuse 8 (or maybe even just the PCM in general) triggered the Service Engine Soon icon. If a battery reset doesn't make it go away and driving it for a while doesn't clear it up I'll have the dealer reset it.

 

Fuse 11 has to do with ignition coils. Can't imagine that causing the noise.

 

Unfortunately the information for fuse 12, non-emission components, is a little vague.

Edited May 6, 2018 by sschnath

[brobeo]

I have a 2015 with 83K miles. I took it to the local Ford dealer for the whining noise. Sounds to me like a hydraulic pump. The dealer contacted Ford and was instructed to take oil sample to see if noise was from engine. Engine good. Next contact from dealer: Ford instructed them to remove tranny and split the case. Haven't heard anything more. Don't expect to until next week. In the meantime I'm driving a free loaner, a new Escape. No complaints thus far. Hoping for a free new tranny. If anybody's car is making this noise and has less than 100K, take it to the nearest dealership ASAP. Can't hurt.

[sschnath]

I'll be curious to hear what they find out because I'm thinking mine is the generator, not that I have anything more to go on other than fuse 12. Have them pull fuse 12 and see if it stops.

 

I don't know if a generator is better or worse than the transmission. I'm thinking either is an expensive fix if it's out of warranty. May be time for me to look at extended warranty coverage if that's even possible with my mileage.

[brobeo]

​Ford is going to replace my transmission under warranty. Dealer had to send Ford pictures or transmission internals. Turned out to be a bad bearing. Likely caused by dirt/old fluid. I'm not a fault because owners manual reads to replace fluid at 100K. I have 83K miles. The dealer said they recommend changing fluid at 60K. Seems that would be a hard sell, considering owners manual 100K recommendation. New tranny coming from MI. Should get my car back next week. Thankful for the 8 year 100K warranty.

[Goopyguy56]

What year fusion do u have?

[Goopyguy56]

Sorry i saw you already posted that it is a 2015

[Goopyguy56]

I wonder if ford actually ever fixed the tranny issues the 2013/14 fusions were known for. Stories like this might just steer me toward the toyota

[ethermion]

I wonder if ford actually ever fixed the tranny issues the 2013/14 fusions were known for. Stories like this might just steer me toward the toyota

Be mindful that only the upset tend to post. The happy customers find other things to do with their time than post superlatives to a forum.

 

2013 here, near 80k miles. Quiet as a mouse, and by far the best car I ever bought. No Toyota in my future.

[md13ffhguy]

Be mindful that only the upset tend to post. The happy customers find other things to do with their time than post superlatives to a forum.

 

2013 here, near 80k miles. Quiet as a mouse, and by far the best car I ever bought. No Toyota in my future.

Oh, that's what I thought at 80k! 95k too! Not so much at 100k... Still, there was no Toyota in my future, either.

[Goopyguy56]

The ffh looks real nice. Hopefully they fixed the tranny issues

[Goopyguy56]

I originaly thought the issue was only in 2013-14 models. Then I see a tsb that includes the 2016 for transmission issues. I have been looking at 2017's because there seem to be a ton of them used. I just don't know if I have enough faith in their longevity considering the transmission issues in the previous three years.

[Goopyguy56]

I originaly thought the issue was only in 2013-14 models. Then I see a tsb that includes the 2016 for transmission issues. I have been looking at 2017's because there seem to be a ton of them used. I just don't know if I have enough faith in their longevity considering the transmission issues in the previous three years.

[Goopyguy56]

I originaly thought the issue was only in 2013-14 models. Then I see a tsb that includes the 2016 for transmission issues. I have been looking at 2017's because there seem to be a ton of them used. I just don't know if I have enough faith in their longevity considering the transmission issues in the previous three years. I saw an older tsb for the 2013-14 models built before a certain date. Later there was another tsb for 2015 and then more recently a 2016 tsb. Its like they never fixed the issue.

[mwr]

Later there was another tsb for 2015 and then more recently a 2016 tsb.

I don't recall a tsb for the transmission for my 2015 FFH.

[Goopyguy56]

TSB 17-0039. Even some 2016 models are affected. Even then we don't know if it has been fixed in later models. This was originally a problem with 13/14 models. They didn't fix it after those years.

[lolder]

The TSB mentions cars built before 8/15/15 so it includes early 2016s. What a bummer! Out of warranty 10 hours of labor plus the transmission.

Edited May 21, 2018 by lolder

[ethermion]

TSB 17-0039 does include 2016 models. I didn't track down the full text, but the summary indicates "SOME" not "ALL".

 

Don't want to jynx our car, but so far, so good. Maybe, as we would say back in the old days, maybe yours was a Monday build... Who knows. Monday in Hermosillo might be even rougher than Monday in Detroit. Tequila and beer are completely different.